Advice on soldering vintage horns

Discussion in 'Trumpet Repair and Modification' started by Anthony7500, Jan 4, 2018.

  1. J. Jericho

    J. Jericho Fortissimo User

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    ROFL
     
  2. Bflatman

    Bflatman Forte User

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    You asked for advice and comments so I will say what I see. I must add that I could not do any better than you I just see some issues that can be addressed.

    1 Parts are not sized correctly so they dont fit well together and need a lot of solder filling in the joint. Make sure they fit tightly together and are not loose before soldering this will make a better looking job.

    2 Parts are misaligned with each other after soldering this comes from point one

    3 There is a lot of solder overflow this may come from too much solder being applied to the joint with little control, Brass workers often use thin solder wire applied precisely to minimise overflow.

    4 There is no evidence of wiping the joint after soldering to remove excess solder external to the joint

    5 There is no evidence of cleanup after the job is soldered black deposits remain on the tubing

    6 There is no evidence of clamping the parts during soldering, clamping holds parts together tightly and minimises solder excess and prevents parts moving around as they are soldered

    7 There is evidence of filing marks and bevelling this suggests to me that parts are not finished well before soldering

    As I said earlier I could do no better. I see Brass tech work as very sophisticated and requiring much training and experience before high quality work can be produced
     
  3. stumac

    stumac Fortissimo User

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    All the old horns I play with that have loose joints, detached stays etc require dismantling because the original solder has badly oxidized, this requires taking all the oxidization off to the bare metal on both surfaces, they are then fluxed and "Tinned" by applying a thin coat of solder to both surfaces, reheating and wiping excess solder off with a rag in the case of slide tubes with a close fit, slide legs I usually put half way into the receiver after checking the receivers are parallel.

    Apply a little flux and reheat, I use a 1mm diameter solid solder, apply to the joint and let the hot metal melt the solder, do not let the torch flame contact the solder, 1mm melts very quickly if near to the flame.

    I use an Orca self contained gas torch for 95% of my work, where more heat is necessary I have an Industrial torch that runs from a 20 lb cylinder with a range of burners, the largest produces a flame 10" in diameter 3 ft long and consumes 9lb of gas/hour, it would destroy a trumpet in seconds.

    My first soldering lesson was 75 years ago at the age of 5, that is another story.

    Regards, Stuart.
     
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  4. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Acetylene is lighter than air, so if your tank leaks, crawl out of the room - the gas rises. Propane is heavier than air, so it goes down to the floor - a problem if you are in the basement...
     
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  5. stumac

    stumac Fortissimo User

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    To add to Rowuk above, treat bottled gas with the utmost care, Propane has the second widest explosive limits of all the gases, in concentrations between 14% and 86% in air will explode if ignited, Hydrogen 3% to 97%.

    The biggest fright of my life was with bottled gas, I used to service a Flame Photometer for the estimation of Sodium and Potassium for a Doctor running a small pathology service. These instruments were always hard to light and this particular evening I became aware of a faint blue flame flickering inside the instrument halfway up the case, the gas had pooled inside the case and was burning at the gas/air interface, I exited promptly and turned the gas off at the cylinder outside and sat behind a large tree in the garden. After 20 minutes there had been no explosion I went back inside and found it had burnt out and proceeded to complete my task.

    Since then I have treated gas with the utmost respect, making sure all connections are secure and no leaks, keeping the door to my workshop open and a flow of air through when soldering or brazing with gas.

    Regards, Stuart.
     
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  6. Osren

    Osren Mezzo Forte User

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    I've done a little soldering on some trumpets/cornets over the past few years.....

    I have noticed that many times when I solder, I tend to screw up the Lacquer finish in those areas that get the hottest (it melts right off). Is there a way to solder on a lacquered horn and still maintain its lacquer?
     
  7. J. Jericho

    J. Jericho Fortissimo User

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    You need to remove the lacquer from the area you intend to solder and then respray afterward.
     
  8. Clarkvinmazz

    Clarkvinmazz Forte User

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    It depends on the lacquer. If it’s oldwr lacquer then probably not, if it’s newer then if you’re careful you can do it with virtually no damage.
     
  9. J. Jericho

    J. Jericho Fortissimo User

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    Yup... tinted lacquer was used often, and duplicating it is near impossible.
     
  10. breakup

    breakup Mezzo Forte User

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    Do you use a torch or an iron?
     

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