Any ideas on60's Rock music with horn parts?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by SteveRicks, Nov 20, 2011.

  1. BrassEye

    BrassEye Pianissimo User

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    Whilst I understand you being pissed off, to a certain extent they're right. Much like jazz has its standards, rock and soul and blues have their standards. It's not unreasonable for people in those particular scenes to expect other people that play in those scenes to know the respective standards. This is a nightmare for someone new to the scene, and they shouldn't have waited until the gig to let you know there were no charts but, to be fair, maybe it would have been an idea for you to ask about charts in advance.

    An awful lot of jazz players would look at you oddly (to put it mildly) if you didn't know, say, Autumn Leaves; the same is true for not knowing Mustang Sally or Brown Eyed Girl in this situation.

    No offence intended.
     
  2. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    It's just as bad or worse in a church setting. ANY "correction" is taken as "not walking in love"! Piano player was having a time on an intro that involved counting (kid you not!). Said player," Just playing what's on my chart"! I went to look at said "chart". LYRICS with chord changes and slash marks (not talking lead sheet either). The slash marks were rests with a big slash mark being the bar. Okay, why the problem? Said player started the count when the said singer finished SAYING/SINGING the last word in the intro!!! Even the congregation now notices and waits/winces when we do this song because it is never ever done the same.
    Kudos to kehaulani on those links. If you can't find them there, transcribe or write your own stuff. I 2nd,3rd, and 4th the advise about being critical of players that don't/won't read. You'll be castigated and eventually asked to leave so tread softly and take a stick to bite on (will save your tongue).
     
  3. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    I don't agree with this. Someone who plays top 40 hits, R&B and Blues is expected to know the "standards"??? What standards??? I don't think so.

    Any band that DOESN'T LIFT A FINGER to help out new people sitting in (without any rehearsals) doesn't deserve any new people. What does it take??? A few charts, some LYRICS (WHAT singer knows they lyrics to hundreds or thousands of songs???).. Get real.

    To all of those who have provided these kinds of nightmares ..... WE'RE A PAPER SOCIETY .... WRITE STUFF DOWN.:evil:

    My own personal (worst) experience like this was when I was being auditioned to be the lead singer in a band. I showed up, they were basically a WALL OF SOUND, provided lyrics that I couldn't read in the dim light they played in (like cave dwellers) ..... and they drank the entire bottle of tequila that I brought.:dontknow:

    Losers. The invited me back but I passed on their band. No thanks. I found out later that they auditioned all the singers like this ..... they wanted one that was bullet proof. If he survived that treatment ..... That's just not the kind of band that I want to be in.
    Turtle
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2011
  4. BrassEye

    BrassEye Pianissimo User

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    Well, yes. To be blunt. You look at the set list of most function bands/R&B bands etc. The same songs turn up again and again. Wilson Pickett, Stevie Wonder, Otis Redding, Kool & The Gang etc. Like I said, if you're new to the scene then fair enough, you probably wouldn't know them, but after you've been around for a while... They ARE standards. In answer to your question about singers, actually quite a few know the words to a lot of songs. Thousands is extreme and unrealistic, but a hundred or more is perfectly possible for a professional singer. If an actor can memorise Shakespeare then a singer can learn a few hundred songs that probably repeat quite a bit.

    Like I said, I don't think the band were right to not let you know about the lack of charts before the gig. I think there was a communication issue on BOTH sides.
     
  5. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    Actors don't just have MANY memorized pieces of Shakespeare that they can WHIP OUT TO ANYONE'S REQUEST.:dontknow: Sorry, I don't know any actors like that.

    Just Soul alone, say 60's soul hits, comprise nearly a hundred songs. Just the radio hits. Then there's the Beatles, the Stones and the rest of the hitmakers from the 60's .... that's a couple hundred more. Then the 70's ..... What about the 50's???

    I'd love to see a set of "Standards" that's not more than a hundred songs or so .... If there was such a thing, I'd wager that not many know them all by heart. Sorry, not buying it.


    Turtle
     
  6. BrassEye

    BrassEye Pianissimo User

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    There are jazz cats that know most of, if not all, the Real Book. That's a heck of a lot more complicated than learning R&B. You can "not buy it" all you like but the fact is, there are people that can do what you don't believe is possible.

    Anyway, like I said: no offence intended.
     
  7. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    No offense taken and none meant either. I'll agree wholeheartedly with you on the Jazz Real Book and how much harder it is than your average R&B .... that is so true.:lol:

    I have the utmost respect for jazz players .... they're the ones who created the Motown sound (the bunch of jazz guys that Barry Gordy recruited). Jazz and classical players, in general, are the most studied I think.

    I just think a lot of headaches could be avoided if bands were more accommodating to people trying to play with them on the fly. A band that understands what a player needs to come in and groove right off the bat is a Godsend. With R&B, someone can give you the chords to a song in a few seconds .... lyric sheets that are readable, etc. Giving NOTHING and just calling the song, IMO, is pretty lame (especially when their instruments are in a different key(s)). I get more help than that at jam sessions. I don't remember the OP saying they called out the key of the song ....:roll:


    Turtle
     
  8. BrassEye

    BrassEye Pianissimo User

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    I keep a book of charts for everything any band I'm in plays (even standards!) in case I have to call someone as a dep who's totally green to R&B*, so I agree with you 100% that it makes the whole process an awful lot smoother! It's just there are some players who wouldn't even open that book because they've played it all a hundred times before.

    Anyway, now that we've totally derailed the OP... Normal service is resumed!

    *I even keep a book with written solos for the jazz standards I do with my other band in case I need to call a dep who can't blow over changes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2011
  9. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    There are people who know a heck of a lot of songs .... I met someone in Canada who, before a life changing accident, knew roughly 1,000 songs by heart. After the accident, he had to relearn how to play the guitar and couldn't memorize songs anymore.:

    But, you're right .... back on topic ... your normal thread will resume now.:lol:


    Turtle
     
  10. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Point of reference. I have over 400 charts in my file folder for church (and this is just "contemporary" stuff, never mind the classics/standards). That is just the songs we've done in the last 5 years. I purged almost as much just so I could sort new charts. That doesn't count the "heart charts" (did one last night, Really fun when the piano player/singer modulates w/o a signal). Swing band I sit in has over 300 charts. I am with you on the "Standards" thing. I can lay down licks for anything if I have a key and where the changes are. Any band that won't give you that are a bunch of narcissistic boneheads. Maybe they don't remember from all the "weed"! ROFLROFLROFL
     

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