Bach Strike/WWBW bankruptcy

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Siegtrmpt, Dec 6, 2006.

  1. Siegtrmpt

    Siegtrmpt Mezzo Piano User

    Nov 21, 2005
  2. robertwhite

    robertwhite Mezzo Piano User

    Nov 11, 2003
    Amazing. They need to cut their employee's pay and benefits, yet they brag about their incredible financial shape to try and land the acquisition. This is why coorporations suck.
  3. Eclipsehornplayer

    Eclipsehornplayer Forte User

    Sep 14, 2005
    Metro Detroit
    Welcome to America!

    Corporate America anyway...
  4. Mikey

    Mikey Forte User

    Oct 24, 2003
    I've been trying to be supportive to both the management and striking workers, as I still think a good Bach trumpet is my favorite instrument to play...

    if Con/Selmer/Steinway goes through with this, I will find another brand to play.

    Tightwad Stoner needs to get his head out of his ___.

    Settle the strike; pay the workers what they want; THEN start aquiring bankrupt companies.
  5. Alex Yates

    Alex Yates Forte User

    Aug 11, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    It is sad to see what is happening with Bach. The only upside is that their situation has forced many folks to return to the drawing board and engineer their own instruments in an attempt to get quality instruments on the market. Bach never had good customer service and has used up the loyalty they have taken for granted for so long. It is nice that we finally have choices out there. Players are looking elsewhere and EVERYwhere to find quality instruments they enjoy playing. Who has time to wait for these corporate jerks to make a good decision? I am actually happy to see handcrafted instruments becoming more popular up against assembly line horns. It is good to see folks using their minds and creativity again. Trumpet making has been on autopilot for much too long IMHO.
  6. rjzeller

    rjzeller Forte User

    Mar 7, 2005
    Rochester, MN
    Sorry, but I think some people need to remember what the heck "at will" employment means. Like it or not, in this type of economy it is up to the employer to determine how much it is willing to pay and it is up to the individual worker to decide how much it is willing to accept. When the two cannot come to an agreement, either one side wins out or else the worker goes elsewhere. In nearly every industry there ARE options for disgruntled employees. They are welcome to leave the company at any time and go wherever they want.

    If they cannot find better pay elsewhere, then it would appear the employer is correct in surmising that the employee may only be worth X when the employee feels their value is Y. If they can, then they should say "screw this job" and take thier skills elsewhere. At some point they'll find an employer who values them and is willing to pay Y...or perhaps they're simply NOT that valuable an employee.

    I mention this because if the wwbw truly is a promising venture, and if it can be managed successfully and make the company good money, then regardless of whatever labor disputes a manufacturer may have, it is a good business decision.

    THe bottom line, though, is that this is independent of the decision to settle with a union (that has already turned down four offers). If you start coupling business decisions with labor disputes like this you quickly strangle a business's effectiveness.

    Just as a business may layoff or fire someone, or HIRE someone at will, so too may an employee quit or leave at will. The decision to strike and go hungry was made by the employees.

    A local theatre here was recently bought out by another chain, and the result was the immeidate cut in pay of 20-30% salary for most of the full time workers. They lost benefits, tenure, and income; yes, it sucks. But they're still putting food on the table and not having to stand in food lines to get fed. Meanwhile, they're all looking for better jobs.

    SOme will manage to find a better job, and they'll be much happier off. Some won't (or aren't looking), becuase they feel that there are other things besides money to think about.

    Again, the real choice is the employees as much as anyone else. If they wish to disempower themselves by granting the union the power to dictate their lives, so be it, but that is all their choice.

    As for me, I'm not a fan of Bach, haven't been for some time. I am also quite saddened to hear that wwbw was up for grabs and in bankruptcy. I guess I wasn't aware. I hope that whomever takes over them manages to do well with it, because they had a great thing going. I also have reservations about a manufacturer controlling one of the largest retailers in the country, the conflict of interest is clear.

    Nevertheless, I think jumping on the "they're evil for starving their employees and spending zillions on another business" rhetoric is a bit much. There is merit on both sides of the argument, even if only one side was ever presented.
  7. Eclipsehornplayer

    Eclipsehornplayer Forte User

    Sep 14, 2005
    Metro Detroit

    While I agree with you in principal I must point out that you tend to become a bit jaded when corporate greed affects you personally.

    I lost my life savings and job to it in October of 2004 when my employer in Michigan gave me and my whole department the boot.

    I guess it's just a matter of perspective eh? :grouphug:
  8. Jon Kratzer

    Jon Kratzer Pianissimo User

    Nov 27, 2003
    Oklahoma City, OK
    Bach has always treated me with respect. When they built my C trumpet for me in late 2000, they made sure that every last desire on my horn was met. If you've ever spoken to the guys in the factory, you know that they have their hearts in the right place. Any questions I've ever had have been answered with a smile and a solid answer. Any problems with my horns, they fix it. I'm sorry that your experiences with Bach has been less than desirable, I know mine has been fantastic....

  9. tpter1

    tpter1 Forte User

    Jan 12, 2005
    Northern New York
    I'm a union member, and I feel I have to disagree with you. The union has rejected four offers. That's because the union is looking out for it's membership and truing to negotiate a fair contract.

    Look for other work? How about the worker with 29 years experience? Who is going to hire someone at a salary level comparable to what he makes now? Where is he supposed to find other work?

    Corporate giants have a tendency to take advatage of their workers when times get tough. CEO's make ridiculous amounts of money, yet employees get laid off to trim costs. Why not take some of that multi-million dollar salary and return it to the company as a savings? Why not make the CEO responsible for failed marketing ventures that are ultimately his responsibility?

    Fair working conditions? Safety? Appropriate insurance/benefits to make sure their families are taken care of should the unspeakable occur? Retirement? How about giving something back to the individual who's invested 30+years of his life to the company? (More than a clock).

    I've been treated fairly poorly by WWBW over the past few years. Their customer service has been atrocious. I've recieved instruments in appalling condition packed like a junior high school kid just chucked them in a box. It was upsetting enough that I do not give them any business...personal or school-related. And I do not recommend them to my students, either. Should their employees be accountable for poor hiring practices or sloppy quality control? Who is responsible for that? It's quite sad, because they USED to be really quite good.
  10. Annie

    Annie Piano User

    Nov 13, 2003
    This is why big corporations are no good...and that they only serve themselves as an entity rather than caring about their workers and customers.

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