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Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by garrettmarvel, Jan 23, 2009.
Wirklich schÃ¶n formuliert! GrÃ¼ÃŸe aus dem Ã–si-Land.
thank you for that post. I would maintain that any attempt to short circuit an established method for learning something (whether that be a beginners book on trumpet, a teacher or just a trumpet playing friend to imitate) is "cheating". You have an incredibly good point on the lack of common vocabulary though. I think this warrants a thread of its own and perhaps we could consolidate it and make it sticky - so no search is necessary.
As far as polite goes, I detest any attempts at political correctness. If we are bringing up a generation of people that worry more about the words used than the message, we have a bigger problem. In the private lessons that I give, I address the problems straight on. The statement "you could have spent more time on this" does not get the results that "you have really disappointed me, I know how good you are" does. This also applies here. Newbie, no teacher, pressure, riffs before earning anything. We have HUNDREDS of posts on this with little or no results. My accusation is not broad. It is a call to earn those skills in a structured way with a real chance for success.
In the eyes of a beginner, I may have sounded tough. In the eyes of some experienced players, there is a desire to delete these repetitious threads immediately. I chose just to post directly to the point and hope that the thread owner gets the message: don't cheat, earn that range and technique.
In the background, I can hear the old natural trumpet players cursing those fancy valves that let just anybody play a tune, predicting the ruin of the field.
As for the "short circuit", I don't think anyone was looking for a miraculous way to learn to play tremendously well with little effort. You seem to keep reading that attitude into their posts.
That's likely a good idea. Even crankiness sometimes has positive side effects.
Will you please stop hiding behind "political correctness"? This isn't about politics. It's about basic, you know, politeness. The old form of that phrase that seems to have been lost as people wanted to say whatever they felt like without caring about the consequences. I'd like to blame the Internet, but it's older than that.
If you're so tempted to delete the threads, might I suggest that instead you segregate them to a DIY zone? Accept that maybe people don't all share your values and expectations, and put them someplace where you don't have to be so dreadfully bored by the repetition? (Heck, you could have the forum software auto-post your warnings on every post.)
I know, I know. That might encourage such dreadful behavior. But it might make this forum seem a lot more welcoming to people who, unsurprisingly to me, use the Internet.
Otherwise, I guess I'll be replying on a regular basis to your blunt "directly and to the point messages" for a long while to come, as it's clear we have a basic difference in values.
I guess that we will have this discussion quite often. I do not hide behind anything and I do not consider the truth (in this case stop messing around and get serious if you are really interested in getting better) to be unpolite. I do consider the watered down to be an insult however. The best place for this discourse would be in a dedicated thread however.
Please do not forget that this is an open forum and that all sides of the issue are allowed. You may not like mine, but have offered the poster no alternative to pressure. My alternative is to get into a structured practice routine. This is what I teach and what I have used many times to help DIYers that have woken up get a real playing life.
If you feel comfortable letting the unknowing live in their bubble, you have to live with that. When anyone here solicits help, I will lay the cards out on the table. There is no hiding if one REALLY wants to get better.
So, instead of trashing me, offer some real meat for the poster. Once you start working with real live players and figure out what really works, your tune will change.
It is very important to have the skill of being able to read music, how did you play guitar/bass? Well there are always some books out there that teach you to read music.
I think it's all in how you present it, not about "hiding" or not. Your "Nintendo cheating" comment was insulting at best - way beyond impolite. And shot at an entire generation at that...
And apparently I don't share your "truth", so we'll be here a while.
I'm not sure what you mean by 'the watered down'. I can't find that in the thread, so it's hard to figure out what the insult is, or what thread to create.
Yes, and I intend to make sure that they are heard, too. I can't say that newcomers getting slammed like that by a moderator makes it feel like the place is open - much less friendly.
I guess that you didn't read my original reply?
Play lower pieces for a while? Don't push your range too fast? Spend a lot of time playing softly? Practice? Maybe even - oh my - get a teacher? I don't get the sense that you encourage folks like me to give detailed advice in any case, but yeah, there was actually advice there. Actually I gave considerably more detail than you did in your initial post before you began SHOUTING.
I can't say I saw any of that describe in your reply.
I didn't see you lay out a lot of cards. I saw complaining about the quality of players daring to enter your game by asking a question. And then, if he leaves, I guess you think he must have been 'hiding'.
I already did "offer some real meat for the poster," as noted above. More than some.
Yeah. Hopefully I'll be able to help beginners more. I sure hope I don't start shouting at them.
See you around....
The new Standard of Exellence method book has the play along CD's as they have had before, but different this time round they include "iPAS"
which is computer aided learning.
An assessment tool. Like the MIC part of Rock Band, you play the trumpet and it will assess your learning in several areas. They have in the program, lesson 7 ,12 etc..from the method books, able to record and save your learning...and even send a report to your teacher if your still in school.
For me its fun to learn, even at 51.
Another thing I do is have my Cornet out in the room with a trumpet stand. I find as it is there visible every day, I play it that much more often. I play the basic books 1 and 2 in Standard of Exellence.
I also have the 1994 Baptist hymnal for Bb trumpet. So there are easy songs that I know and can learn and perform at church when they allow me to play.
Do look into the music shop in your town and see if they offer lessons. Or look around for a teacher willing to show you more precise what needs to be done and how.
Lessons are a good thing, but some go the other way and never pick up an instrument till they can afford lessons or go back to college and learn from the pro's. Lessons can cost the individual a bit. I took several months lessons and money was the issue then and still is now, I'm not taking lessons at the moment.
I am looking for ways to practice and play with others. I have a keyboard and I place a spare Mouthpiece on a key and it plays the note till I lift it off, of course, but then I try to match it with my cornet. ( I need to play a note higher though ) and that is a lesson in itself. whole steps, half steps, etc...as well as LONG NOTES.
As the keyboard plays the longest note I ever heard, I would match that note with my Cornet, then play around that note, flat or sharp fingerings and hear the difference.
Just my experiences, that's all I can share. That in itself could be worth something to someone.
Why don't the arguments about how someone says something just stop? You are not helping the original poster by arguing. Just tell him simply that he NEEDS A PRIVATE TEACHER. If he wants to seriously learn to play trumpet he will take notice. We do not need to insult anybody or argue.
Except that I disagree with you, and don't think that he necessarily NEEDS A PRIVATE TEACHER.
I guess you missed that part of the argument.
And even if he does find a teacher, there are ways to tell people that it's a good idea without SHOUTING AT THEM ABOUT WHAT WE "KNOW" FROM AFAR.
I guess you just want to argue, when all I am doing is trying to help the poster. Therefore, I will say no more on this subject. Go argue with someone else.