Besson Serial Number

Discussion in 'Vintage Trumpets / Cornets' started by TF Whitely, Apr 5, 2007.

  1. TF Whitely

    TF Whitely New Friend

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    Apr 5, 2007
    I have aquired a Besson trumpet and I'm trying to find some information on the model, year and value. The serial number is 319423. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks TF.
     
  2. screamingmorris

    screamingmorris Mezzo Forte User

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    Apr 4, 2007
    The Web sites I looked at don't list such large serial numbers for Besson, apparently only giving serial numbers for "vintage" Bessons:
    www.thebrassbow.com/Serial.html
    www.musictrader.com/besson.html

    Then a site said that perhaps I should be looking at serial numbers according to Boosey and Hawkes, owner of Besson after year such-and-such, so I went to this site which indicates that your trumpet was probably made circa 1960 (note that "brass" has its own column:
    Lars Kirmser's Music Trader - Boosey & Hawkes Serial Number List

    This site also says that your serial number dates from very late 1960 since #319805 dates from January 1961 ("From October 1954, instruments stamped with the "Besson" name were given serial numbers in the above Boosey & Hawkes sequence"):
    Horniman Museum collections

    Hope that helps.

    - morris
     
  3. Tootsall

    Tootsall Fortissimo User

    4,529
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    Oct 25, 2003
    Yee HAW!
    The other consideration is that it "might" be a US-made horn in which case it will be stamped as such. If that is so, then contact the Kanstul factory at Welcome to Kanstul Musical Instruments since they had the licence to manufacture for Besson's North American market.
     
  4. screamingmorris

    screamingmorris Mezzo Forte User

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    17
    Apr 4, 2007
    I remember seeing one site saying that the White Company (having nothing to do with Besson) recycled serial numbers after a certain date, so that you could actually have several trumpets from across the decades with identical serial numbers.
    If the people who make Besson have done the same thing, then that would certainly throw a monkey wrench into the dating I mentioned.

    As far as who makes what, I had no idea Kanstul made Besson for North America.
    I even saw one eBay seller claiming that the Holton T606 was made by Yamaha, although Holtons are usually made by Conn-Selmer.

    Do you ever get the feeling that the manufacturers are trying to mess with our minds?

    - morris
     
  5. Tootsall

    Tootsall Fortissimo User

    4,529
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    Oct 25, 2003
    Yee HAW!
    Not only did they... I have a Besson "international" and have been able to get parts for it from Kanstul.... but they made quite a few and they are generally pretty darn good ones too!
     
  6. TF Whitely

    TF Whitely New Friend

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    Apr 5, 2007
    Right on guys, thanks for the interest. The mouthpiece is stamped "Made in England" and there was a bottle of valve oil in the case labled BESSON LONDON. The only markings on the trumpet that I can find are BESSON and what looks like initials FB or just a very fancy B. The valves are stamped 1, 2 and 3. And of course the serial number is stamped on the middle valve. The case is hard plastic with a gold coloured tag marked BESSON. I don't know if that makes any difference in the identification. Thanks again. TF
     
  7. Cornet1

    Cornet1 Pianissimo User

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    May 22, 2005
    Essex, England
    If yo kook at the 'Besson' engraving on the bell you will find the model name in smaller letters either above or below. Don't get confused by the name of an English town such as 'Stratford' 'Oxford' etc as that IS the model name not the place of manufacture.
     
  8. Bonasa

    Bonasa Pianissimo User

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    Feb 9, 2008
    Western New York
    I've found the same type horn: absolutely no markings on it other than "F. Besson" atop the bell and a serial number of "337XXX" on the second valve. It's lacquer with nickel slides and has a 1st valve saddle and a 3rd vale removable throw ring. The lacquer is original, so I'm certain no other identifying marks could have been buffed out. It looks closest to the photos I've seen of the 609 model, but I'm confused because there's no USA or Kanstul stamp anywhere on it. Any ideas?
     
  9. MFfan

    MFfan Fortissimo User

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    Sep 13, 2006
    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    I would agree on the 60's era. From my list it would be closer to 1964-5 in my estimation. I have a 55-57 Besson 8-10 trumpet with the serial 250xxx. There may be some engraving on bell that says 8-10, 2-20 or 10-10 if the pro model. You could go to Horn-u-copia to the Besson thread and see examples. Maybe one like your's is there.:-)
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2008
  10. MFfan

    MFfan Fortissimo User

    3,245
    87
    Sep 13, 2006
    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    Here is a good site for sorting out various Besson models.The Besson Loyalist
     

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