Big School=Big Time?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Principaltrumpet, Jun 10, 2007.

  1. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    I do not think that a prof. capable of placing students will work in an environment with limited opportunities for very long.

    I think the list of teachers that train reality would be relatively easy to put together. Derek Reaban probably has a database with the teachers of all employed orchestral players! Maybe he can chime in here!
     
  2. Siegtrmpt

    Siegtrmpt Mezzo Piano User

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    This is true and it's not all about teaching or learning to play. How well a teacher is connected to the professional performing world and how willing they are to help a student get connected is the key. This happens a lot at big name schools since the students are usually a pretty select group walking in the door and the teachers are well known in performing circles. It's more about the teacher than the school though.
     
  3. stchasking

    stchasking Forte User

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    If the auditions are blind you should not be judged on who, what, where or gender. St. Louis symphony is brutally cautious in their auditions. Convincing all the symphonies to adopt blind auditions will level the playing field, or stage as it were.

    Vince Chicowitz turned out some great symphony players. His legacy students may be worth trying out. Leonard Candelaria is one. Judith Saxton.
    Bud Herseth went to Luther College in Iowa but we all know that was a long time ago.
     
  4. tromj

    tromj Piano User

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    I think if you look at the resumes, you will see certain names popping up again and again. For the current group of forty somethings (Bilger, Sachs, Curnow) that means Mark Gould. Another group seems to come from Ghitalla, another seems to have Jim Thompson and Geyer/Butler on their resumes. A certain generation of west coast guy all studied with Jim Stamp. (Poper, Stevens, etc.)
    On the other hand, that's only because we have heard of these guys. I play with a lot of guys in NYC who's resumes include Louis Mucci, John Coffey, Ed Treutel, and Carmine Caruso. As does mine, at least for the last two. Obviously, these working tumpeters had a different playbook in mind regarding their musical carreers. And then there are all the guys who studied with Gould, Ghitalla, West, Austin, Thompson, etc. who are computer programmers instead.
     
  5. Siegtrmpt

    Siegtrmpt Mezzo Piano User

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    Does St. Louis extend a job offer to the person who wins a blind audition or is there some later phase where an applicant performs with the orchestra for a week or the screen comes down for a personal/playing session to determine the final selection?
     
  6. robertwhite

    robertwhite Mezzo Piano User

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    The poster's original question was "Is there hope for me"? The answer to that has nothing to do with where you went to school.

    Great teachers make a huge difference, but they don't get the jobs for you. All the great players who came out of Juilliard, Northwestern, etc. had the requisite talent, dedication, and seriousness to make it happen. The excellent instruction they received was no doubt crucial, but those same teachers have had many students go nowhere (just like any teacher).

    That said, anyone serious about orchestral playing is going to have to spend quality time with someone from the field. If your undergrad school doesn't provide this, resources like summer festivals, Civic Orchestra of Chicago, New World, etc. can help improve your focus and clarify your goals (though they are very competitive programs to begin with).
     
  7. stchasking

    stchasking Forte User

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    We need to ask Susan Slaughter or Tag Larson what the final examination involved. Anybody volunteer to call the symphony office?

    Tag is with the Chicago Symphony. I hope I have his name correct.
     
  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    It still gets back to the same thing, to win an audition, you have to have a grip on the style and character of orchestral playing as well as the talent and drive.
    Even at a blind audition, your command of the repertoire will come out - and maybe a little color from your teacher. Some of Charlie Schlueters kids were trained so well that they got jobs in spite of the Monettes that they play ;-)
    A word to Joshua the original poster: yes, you have a chance -
    1) IF you get the repertoire counseling and opportunities that you need
    if not, then you will need to find help elsewhere
    2) IF you have the innate talent and drive
    nobody here can help you, you do or you don't
    3) IF the audition process is neutral
    I have no experience in the states, other people will have to comment, Europe is generally not neutral
     
  9. cornetguy

    cornetguy Mezzo Forte User

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    Let's open up another big can in this discussion. Sometimes in the big schools it is better to be a graduate student then an undergraduate, because most of the undergraduate students will pretty much have one ensemble experience, symphonic band (not even wind ensemble). The smaller schools that don't have a large graduate program, the undergraduates get opportunities to play in orchestra and wind ensemble that they may not get in the larger schools. At least this has been my observation.
     
  10. tromj

    tromj Piano User

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    Cornetguy makes a good point. When I went to Brooklyn College, I played first in the orchestra, Opera Orchestra, Big Band, annd various chamber music ensembles. I would not have gotten that opportunity in a big school. On the other hand, I was probably not pushed as hard as I could have been because a) the program was too small to accomodate big works by the orchestra and b) the critical mass that would have fostered greater competition annd ambition simply wasn't there.
     

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