BREAKTHROUGH!!! (I have finally broken the embouchure code. I think.)

Discussion in 'Trumpet Pedagogy' started by Sabutin, Aug 7, 2009.

  1. azhiba

    azhiba New Friend

    Aug 25, 2009
    I must admit that I do not understand a single word of what you chaps are talking about!!!
  2. Sabutin

    Sabutin Pianissimo User

    Aug 7, 2009
    New York City
    Well at least you are being honest about it, azhiba. Many of the preceding posts are from people who do not have a clue about what I am saying here and do not want to admit it.

    Have you read my original post?

    On page one?

    If so...what is it that you do not understand?


    P.S. I have a good friend in Copenhagen...Erling Kroner. Do you ever see him? I know he works a great deal around the city. If you do see him, say hello from Sam Burtis. He'll know...
  3. Sabutin

    Sabutin Pianissimo User

    Aug 7, 2009
    New York City
    The same could be said for you. You have answered none of my substantive questions; instead you have simply thrown another insult.

    Which neither bothers nor surprises me.

    If you are so upset with what I say and/or the way that I say it, why not just go away and let people who are interested have some room? This kind of thread piracy sucks.

    It really does.

    Thanks in advance...

  4. gzent

    gzent Fortissimo User

    Nov 5, 2003
    Rochester, MN
    You know Sam, its kinda funny, but a few years ago I used to take the whole
    trumpet forum / debate thing really seriously. I always felt a need to respond to people that challenged my statements.

    I really don't look at the forums the same anymore. Well, for sure, there are the rare occasions when someone of advanced knowledge, say a rowuk, or a Nick D. or Wilmer, to name a few I truly respect, will make a post that has educational value for me. Not that these seasoned pros post things that aren't educational, far from it!i Is just that after a while you start to hear the same things over and over and it becomes rather dull.

    These days, however, the forums are now an entertainment source for me.
    A 24/7 trumpet reality show, if you will. So, when someone interesting like you comes along of course I tune in. I'm not alone, look at how many views this thread has.

    Now, clearly its not because you have anything substantive to bring to TM. I mean a 60-something year old trombone player telling a bunch of old trumpet pros how to play better - that's pure genius!

    I'd liken you to a sort of entertainer, let me think...Yes! Perhaps a Dane Cook or in your generation, a Don Rickles, of the trumpet world, yes, that's it!

    You see, I know most of what Dane Cook (our Don Rickles) says is audacious, crass and generally tasteless; and even though what he says does contain a few elements of truth, similar to you, Sam, he is interesting for his shocking entertainment value and outrageous stretching of real life situations.

    That whole bit about being a highly sought after brass instructor is a hoot, for example!

    Of course, I don't really think you are a boor or I would have said you were a boor.
    I think you are most likely a very decent person, probably someone's dear old grandpa, who, like Dane Cook, likes to perform and gain attention by using dialogue that shocks people by walking a fine line of being insulting yet funny, demeaning, yet comical in the bluest way.

    You, Sam, are talented at pulling this all off and keeping people taking a trombone player seriously. Again, pure genius!

    Anywho, in order to keep the free entertainment rolling, at times I must respond to talented, off-color pranksters like yourself to keep the whole give and take gag going
    and make believe that I actually care what some trombone player thinks! What a brilliant skit! I remember this sax player that tried to pull it off about 3 or 4 years ago, but people took him too seriously and almost had him linched!

    Seriously, would I leave this thread and miss out on your next little story about how you fixed MF's breathing problems, or once showed Dave Monette how to properly lapp a valve piston? Heck no! This is better than the time the cable company accidently gave me HBO free for a year!

    Well, I'm going to get some popcorn...keep up the gag....
    ....trombone player....embouchure expert....bwah,ha,ha....Sam, you slay me, homey!
  5. Bachstul

    Bachstul Mezzo Forte User

    Jan 25, 2009
    I'm sorry to post....I don't have enough experience to encounter; .. my comment, from my advertising experience, as well as most of you TV watchers out there, the first post I could not finish reading./.... It screams "INFO-MERCIAL", you know?

    The lingo,..... "but wait, there's more!!!!!!!"

    I'm just expecting that "for only $19.95 plus s&h".....

    Several posters advised him wisely already....... perhaps he should re-read some of eleven pages, though I respect his position greatly, I'm not buying.

    I know of several burned out furniture craftsmen who, when they are tired (Sam Maloff, RIP ) of the trade want to use their name and experience to sell education of their craft in books and DVD. Hi Kelly Mehler, hello Mark Duginske, to name a few more.

    No offense to this "I'll sell you what I know in a book or video" practice,... all celebrities and ex-politicians do this.

    I have no disrespect for this Sabutin fellow, or any other who posted on this thread.

    I am, however sadly disappointed that A.N.A. Mandez has not once posted the pop corn eating smiley, or his ever popular two pancakes on a bunny photo. This, right now, is what's eating a terrible hole in my well being.
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2009
  6. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    So after 3 pages of no real meat and a bunch of aggressive, obnoxious posts, we are little further than on the first page.

    He obviously has no explanations other than his own feelings. Miracles really don't fit in behavioural science or trumpet playing, and as many players as I have worked with in the past 40 years, the miracles have been musical and not mechanical. Habits take time to break and he is no exception regardless of his claim.

    I guess we can't forget that the high jump was revolutionized by the Folsbury flop many years ago. That is why I always look at such claims carefully. I see more flop than Folsbury here.

    So after reading all of his posts, my take is: ignorance is bliss. Let him believe in his miracle. Such things have kept many players psychologically afloat. If he thinks that he has the answer, time will tell. My advice is take it with a grain of salt. If you find something inspirational, then it may have been worth it. If his only argumentation is putting down people that don't agree, we will just lock down the thread. Then he can go back to his low brass forum - if they will have him.

    Things too good to be true are always exactly that.
  7. thebugleboy

    thebugleboy Pianissimo User

    Dec 10, 2008
    Deep South
    Rowuk, you with Gzent and Bachstul have rapped my fingers with the ruler. I guess I'm guilty of egging this guy on for entertainment's sake. this is sort of like tying a string to a Junebugs leg and watching him fly around in circles...until he eventually pulls his own leg off. This has been fun, though I did not enjoy the attacks on Rowuk (and others). These antics can indeed slog the forum, so I will back off.
    This is a great forum where I have found many gems of wisdom and fellowship. I appreciate all you trumpet brothers.
  8. Sofus

    Sofus Forte User

    Jul 26, 2008


    DonĀ“t EVER erase this thread!!!



    Last edited: Aug 27, 2009
  9. Veldkamp

    Veldkamp Piano User

    Mar 29, 2004
    the Netherlands
    As Rafael Mendez use to say: ""Practice, practice, practice, there are no shortcuts."
  10. azhiba

    azhiba New Friend

    Aug 25, 2009
    Thanks, Sam.
    I guess I just need to read it once again to understand your theories.
    I'm familiar with the name Erling Kroner, he's a skilled trombone player, isn't he?, but I have never met him or even ever heard him playing.

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