Can certain brands/models help your upper register?

Discussion in 'Horns' started by Larry Gianni, Feb 29, 2004.

  1. Larry Gianni

    Larry Gianni Piano User

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    Nov 11, 2003
    Los Angeles
    OK, this is a gear topic , but please no bashing or trashing any brands here, just relay experiences and opinions. Politely and with respect to the other posters. Again, there are really no right or wrong answers or experiences. This is all subjective stuff.

    Can a certain trumpet with its characteristically engineered designed resistance, help with your usable range. Again, we are talking usable range not: practice room “range, sometimes there is quite a difference. Are certain brands geared toward making it play easier and longer in the upper register?

    I say “YES “
    Most times, a player of a certain skill, when fresh, can get all the same pitches in the higher register to come out, on any brand but what usually is the case is the notes are somewhat smaller, weaker and unusable on a certain brand and easier , quicker and usable on another brand. Now some players actually can play higher on one brand vs. another.

    This is a little different that a question of which brand would you use to play lead trumpet which more a question of projection and “sizzle “.

    Sidebar:

    I got a call from a friend that was playing lead trumpet on the road show of “Miss Saigon “and during the conversation he relayed he had tried the Walt Johnson Book “Double Hi C in 10 minutes “and actually liked it because he used the book and Walt’s technique shown and found he could, for the first time, get the pitch of a Double Hi C to sound. Now, mind you, this was not a usable note, but it gave him the confidence that he “could do it†and with practice and perseverance, he would eventually be able to have that in his arsenal if he chooses to. This is not a “for or against†of Walt’s book – Walt never promises a usable double C in ten minutes, but just to be able to play the pitch thru a trumpet.

    Same with range and a trumpet.

    For me, (and many others) the Calicchio’s are the biggest help in that respect,the†Ease of Range†perspective. That’s why they are my main trumpet, ( plus a host of others out here ) using different leadpipe/bell combinations for different sounds and textures. As I said in previous posts, I won and play different brands when necessary, but I really try to stay with My Calicchio’s so I retain the same “ blow “ thru-out my playing and I don’t confuse any “ muscle memory “ that I need to perform at my best. Now, if I can play it on my Calicchio, I can play it on any brand from a Conn Director on up because of my working with a Calicchio so long.

    Dealing with range, the hardest thing to do is to actually get the coordination and schronization to emit from the trumpet the pitch you are after. For a while in my development, I actually had a gap of a third in the extreme high register that forced me have to work down for the top pitch to try to “buzz ‘the pitches that eluded me. That is called a “break “and usually occurs between Hi A and Hi Bb or in that neighborhood. Now when you pick up a trumpet and can play a range note/pitch that you couldn’t on your present brand/model instrument doesn’t it give you the confidence that now , with work and practice, the possibility to eventually “own “that note is likely. Remember hitting your first Hi C, then having to play it on the music was such a “hair rising “experience. Now, possibly, it is just part of you “range “repertoire and other, higher notes, give that ‘uneasy “feeling when on the printed page and a “Hi C “is just another pitch to play?

    Larry
     
  2. W Scott

    W Scott Piano User

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    Dec 8, 2003
    Carson City, NV.
    I'd second your choice of a Calicchio for high range work. I've played a 1s/2 several times and the high range is just effortless. If the darn things weren't so expensive I'd buy one!

    Bill
     
  3. jamesfrmphilly

    jamesfrmphilly Piano User

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    Oct 31, 2003
    the north philly ghetto
    no brand can help my high register.
     
  4. bugler16

    bugler16 Pianissimo User

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    Dec 14, 2003
    This is an interesting question/idea that you have posted. I have noticed this difference between my two Bb's (same brand different models). I have a Bach Strad 43* and a Strad 37, both are the same,both standard setup (as far as the leadpipes and tuning slides are concerned) all the way down to the fact that they were both goldplated by Kanstul. If it weren't for the bell size and weight difference these horns would be identical. However it seems that the 43* really opens up in the high register. I can play (usable) range both higher and for longer on this horn, than on the 37. However it does not have the presence or the focus to the sound that the 37 has. I currently use my 37 for all of my playing because of the focus and the presence that it has both in a section and as a solo instrument, however I must work harder to play in the upper register. I find it amazing that such a seemingly small difference between the physical make up of two horns can make such a difference in playing characteristics.
     
  5. MPM

    MPM Pianissimo User

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    Nov 10, 2003
    Larry,

    I think that a well made horn (Bach, Calicchio, Schilke, Scodwell, Lawler ...) provided you balance it well with the right mpc with the right player it's what's important. Examples:Charley Davis (Bach) Ingram (Schilke) Findley & Trigg (Calicchio) Tony Scodwell & host of other in Las Vegas (Scodwell) Charlie Berrtini in Orlando FL (Lawler).

    I really have to say that Calicchio trumpets do lend them selves towards a very nice sounding commercial sound, with an extreme ease of playing! No doubt there !!!

    Has there been any talk about the "Chuck Findley" Calicchio? :?:

    As far as what has helped with my usable range ... striving to be an "efficient player". (edited for continuity)

    I think the key is making wise choices ... pick the right tool for the right job!
     
  6. Larry Gianni

    Larry Gianni Piano User

    265
    4
    Nov 11, 2003
    Los Angeles
    Hi all

    One more thing,

    The major point of this thread is not about an " extreme " range, but range in general.

    Again, range is a subjective term. At certain points in a player's development , the tern " range " means different things. But I wanted to stay in the useble range area.

    Many really fine players never explored the extreme register of the instrument, both commercial and classical (Although, I heard Rob Roy McGreggor of the Los Angeles Phil do a warm-up extending to Double C keeping that same beautiful sound all the way up and down) and have been quite happy and successful.

    So , has a different brand/model trumpet allowed you to get over a hurdle without hours of practice and frustration just by it's design and engineering?

    Larry
     
  7. MPM

    MPM Pianissimo User

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    Nov 10, 2003
    Sorry Larry,

    My bad for getting off the subject. :oops:

    For me personaly the answer is no. No particular trumpet brand / design has allowed me to 'not' have to practice to get over hurdles. All things being even (as in any partucular model trumpet being well made) I can only do what I can do. What the horn does for me, is help me best get the sound I hear in my head out the bell.

    In that respect I think the horns have made a difference. Helped some with endurance because I feel as though I'm not working as hard to get the sound I want.

    I'll be very interested to hear others observations! We're all different and pick our various tools of the trade for reasons.
     
  8. Larry Gianni

    Larry Gianni Piano User

    265
    4
    Nov 11, 2003
    Los Angeles
    MPM,

    Hey, no worries - there is no off topic's here in Calicchio land and we can discuss any brand that anyone wants - pro's and con's. The way a thread grows is what keeps the conversation interesting. I would like more players to display the city where they reside and maybe a first name at the bottom of the post. Keep's it a little more personable, plus just by knowing the part of the country they live in, more questions/thoughts seem to grow from the discussion.

    I wanted to make sure that certain opinions and observations were not left out due to the participant thinking that their range at this state of there playing kept them out of the issue/question. It doesn't or their equipment, again it doesn't

    As you know , range and it's achievement take on different meanings and significance as you progress as a player or are put into different playing situations. Not all of us are as lucky as Wayne Bergeron who had a double C in the 7th grade. The rest of us take different paths with it's trials and errors getting to a comfortable range, but the challenge of the next note is always around the corner.

    Jon Faddis once told me he tells people/writers to not write parts above Double C for him to play, even thou he can play much higher. He likes the comfort level of being able to 9 times out of 10 to nail that double C. Roger Ingram took Maynard's book to a Double D when before a Hi Bb was the top of the writing so now everyone after Roger wants that Double D to speak. Understand?

    Larry
     
  9. MPM

    MPM Pianissimo User

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    Nov 10, 2003
    Larry,

    Yes I know what you mean. High notes are fun, but really blown out of proportion. Some of my favorite recordings ... old Doc LP's, Sinatra with Gozzo on lead ... a G was it, and then sparingly. Guys like Roger & Wayne, and Faddis (as you mentioned them) really rasied the bar for us guys, who struggle to figure out which end of the horn to stick the mpc into!

    But back to your original question ... in retrospect ... horns with ml (.459 - .460) bores work best for me. I have a very hard time playing large bore trumpets for example a Getzen Eterna Severinsen Lg bore (did John Audino play one of those?) Schilke X3, large bore Holtons (St 302 MF Horn) or the large bore Calicchio Freddie Hubbard configuration. And, while it was a great sounding trumpet!!!! and I mean great!!! a few years back when Kanstul was making the Besson Meha's ... 5 minutes & I was dead!



    Michael

    Southern FL
     
  10. Kenzo

    Kenzo Pianissimo User

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    Nov 18, 2003
    Bristol, Connecticut
    Larry,

    Interesting topic. Can a particular brand of horn affect one's range???
    Perhaps. I know that is not a valid answer but I will address this from my experience.

    Some horns are more high end friendly than others. For me that IS the case. I find I can last longer when playing lead on some makes/models than on others. Does this mean I prefer the sound? Not necessarily. While my horns may have a "squirrelly" A4 I generally prefer the sound of my horns to others that may LOCK the A4. I think the next question should be, What horn gets the sound you want AND is most EFFICIENT for you.

    While I have the same range on all horns some horns are more high end friendly than others but do they get the quality of sound I am looking for?? Often the answer to this question is no. The bigger issue is do the horns that have an easier high end sound good to the audience? Good question eh?

    The bottom line, in my opinion, is trumpet playing is a matter of compromise and balance. We need to get the BEST sound in the most EFFICIENT way we can. Remember, a carpenter does not have only one saw.

    Thanks for reading and always strive to sound GREAT!
     

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