Charlier #1 articulation question

Discussion in 'Orchestra / Solo / Chamber Music' started by musiclifeline, Feb 28, 2005.

  1. musiclifeline

    musiclifeline New Friend

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    Mar 18, 2004
    Manhattan
    Manny,
    Got a quick question... in Charlier #1, the slurred section that begins (Bb trumpet key): A Bb A B A, there are leaps from A to top line F and then from A to A above the staff. In the book, it looks like those leaps are to be slurred, but on Clyde Hunt's recording, it sounds like he is tonguing the top notes. (I am aware of but have not heard David Baldwin's recording.)

    I'm curious as to which (slurred or tongued) is the preferred/accepted/intended method of playing that passage, in particular, the top-line F and A above the staff. It's a minor detail, but I'm just trying to reconcile a recording with the printed music.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Jeroen Jongeling

    Jeroen Jongeling Pianissimo User

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    Nov 10, 2003
    Amsterdam!!!
    I'm not Manny (duhhh..), but very familiar with Charlier's book. Let me say: play what is written.
    The etudes work great if you play 'm as they are.
    In my humble opinion the Charlier etudes are the best written etudes I've ever come across.
    Pierre Thibaud also recorded the etudes with piano. A real joy to hear!

    Jeroen.
     
  3. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

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    Music,

    I'm with Jeroen: go with the print.

    ML
     
  4. musiclifeline

    musiclifeline New Friend

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    Mar 18, 2004
    Manhattan
    Thankya thankya Manny and Jeroen... will do.... and will try not to continue making a mess of the octave slur. (It's funny, I can do it fine if I'm just playing those 8 bars, but if I start from the top of the etude, I can't quite make that slur! Will keep at it though.)
     
  5. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

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    Sep 29, 2004
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    That's because you're breathing diferently by the time you get there and you're experiencing lip fatigue from embouchure instability. It's a classic thing. The breathing is the place to start, though. Big breaths to maintain relaxation all the time! The breath you take when you take a running start at it is different form sneaking in sips and then trying to support the embouchure with those sips.

    ML
     
  6. musiclifeline

    musiclifeline New Friend

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    Mar 18, 2004
    Manhattan
    Iiiiiiiiinteresting. I'll experiment with that as soon as I can. One consistent problem for me in etudes like this is that I'm so unfamiliar with classical styles that I rarely use fermatas to take a big breath... Now that I've heard some recordings, I've got a much better idea of how you're supposed to be able to make it through these things. (I've always been a jazz and commercial player... this is a bit new to me.)

    Thanks again!
     
  7. Tootsall

    Tootsall Fortissimo User

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    Oct 25, 2003
    Yee HAW!
    This may have also occurred to you... if it has, please excuse the redundancy. I just got home from a band workshop in Regina Saskatchewan. The man doing the trumpet sectional was Dr. Ed Lewis. He studied at Eastman and got his D. MA from NYU where his thesis (or paper) was on the physiology of trumpet players. He held the lead trumpet position with the US Army field band a while back and has played and recorded in all genres of music.

    Essentially, he got virtually all of the "top trumpet players" from across all genres (Lew Soloff, Wynton Marsallis, Jon Faddis, Phil Smith... etc etc.) and gave them a horrendously difficult set of exercises to perform for two solid hours. At the end they had to end up on a solid high "F". Some of them found the exercise easy (he said that Faddis took most of it up at least an octave and stated that he could do that all day long!) He contacted Maurice Andre but could not work out a schedule to "test" him.

    Anyway... he was looking for similar postures and characteristics in their playing that could explain their strength and endurance. The #1 item that came out was that they sat with their knees apart and with their thighs at around a 90º angle! Apparently it opens up the lower belly and permits a lot more "tankage" of air. He had us try it (around 20 adult trumpet players) and.... son-of-a-gun.... it works. If you are breathing right and maximizing your potential your endurance will climb dramatically and your chops will get nowhere near as fatigued.

    He also discussed tilting your head (don't do it), and playing with your head thrust forward (usually in an attempt to raise the bell). He said that it is safer to play with your head "back" (think of the way a chicken or a pigeon thrusts it's head forward and back when it walks... you want the "back" or "double chin" position). It is his contention that this leaves your neck muscles far less likely to suffer rupture or other physical problems... in essence it strengthens that area.

    He was asked if this might affect whether the bell points up, down or whatever and he said "Don't worry about the bell position... your teeth are going to dictate that anyway and any attempt on your part to force the bell "up" (or down if you have severe underbite) will weaken your neck."

    Anyhow, it was a great weekend and we had a heck of a lot of fun. Learning some stuff certainly was "icing on the cake". Hope you find some of the above useful.
     
  8. tpter1

    tpter1 Forte User

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    Jan 12, 2005
    Northern New York
    Tootsall- Interesting study. I'm always looking for things to help reinforce good posture in my students. This will be helpful! Reminds me of something I read in one of Manny's posts "...toes pointed forward, head aligned over the spine."
     

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