Comeback player w/ Arbans Question

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by PhatmonB6, Jan 16, 2005.

  1. PhatmonB6

    PhatmonB6 Mezzo Piano User

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    Jan 16, 2005
    Minnesota
    I have been back into it for a year after 25 off. My instructor has me working in Arbans and also Rubanks. The question is more out of curiosity...In Arbans on page 152 #62 is Cadences. What level is a player at when they can play this with no problems? Would this be considered intermediate or college level playing? I ask cause someday I hope to play # 62. The site of it intrigues me ;-)
     
  2. dbacon

    dbacon Mezzo Piano User

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    Oct 24, 2003
    Scottsdale, AZ.
    You play it when you play it, no matter whether H.S., college, whatever.

    If someone plans a career in trumpet playing, all of Arbans should be done and down rather well before college. It's the language of the Concerto.
     
  3. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

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    Sep 29, 2004
    USA
    Dear D,

    I heartily disagree!

    Much, much of the work I did with Vacchiano was straight out of Arban's. My first lesson was exclusively from that book. Then he made me go get the bass clef version as well!

    We never got through it, either. He did so much that was different from how other teachers teach from it. The books I used with him were:

    Arban's
    St. Jacome
    Sachse
    Charlier
    Aaron Harris
    Vassily Brandt
    Top Tones

    There were limited studies from other methods but those were really just once in a while.

    ML
     
  4. pops

    pops Pianissimo User

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    Mar 17, 2004
    Dallas
    Interesting question.

    I know HS kids that can play it. I know pro players that can NOT.


    I would like to see a student finish the Arban, Williams, Brandt, Schlossberg, Charlier plus the Orchestral Excerpts before leaving College. (Regardless of the type of music they choose. I make lead players who come to see me play these things to learn technique.)


    It is really not nearly as hard to play as it looks. (All of those tiny notes look intimidating.) IF you are well versed in your basic tongue slurs (what lips slurs should really be called) then this is playable.
    The basics are to let the tongue level change the pitch instead of the lip. (I am well aware that the lip CAN change pitch alone. However; the tongue can do it FASTER and that is what is needed in this case.)


    There are 2 keys here. Do 1 and only 1 line at a time until it feels good to you. And keep the air moving at all times but keep it changing.
    Think haa or taa (if tonguing) for notes below the staff:
    hoo or too (if tonguing) for notes in the staff:
    hee or tee (if tonguing) for notes at the top and above the staff.

    There are of course variations of each sound but this gets the basic idea across.


    We tend to look at things and make them 10 times harder than they are.
     
  5. bandman

    bandman Forte User

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    Oct 16, 2004
    Lafayette, LA, USA
    Well said Manny!

    I used the Arban when studying with John Wright of the USMC President's Own, and also when studying with Sanchez. When I got to college I thought my teacher would be so impressed. Instead we went back and played half the studies I had already played again, but did them even better. My Arban book is now 35-years old and I still play out of it everyday.

    I don't think there is a time when anyone should master the Arban book. As was said in a post above; "YOU GET IT WHEN YOU GET IT". You will find years later that you will be returning to certain exercises because you are having trouble with a certain part of your playing. When doing so, you will undershoot your ability and then work it back up slowly and properly.

    One last point, never try to compare yourself with a level. There are high school kids who play like pros, and high school kids who play pretty bad. If you insist on comparing yourself with something, make recording of yourself and play it a month from now. If your playing better than the recording then you are moving in the right direction!
     
  6. dbacon

    dbacon Mezzo Piano User

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    Oct 24, 2003
    Scottsdale, AZ.

    Dear M,

    Thanks for the reply, but not sure where we disagree.

    In H.S., did you practice from Arban? I'm guessing there's not a page in Arban you could not play rather well, and early in your career.

    Getting Mr. Vacchiano's sound and style into your sound and style must have made a great impact! :cool:
     
  7. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

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    USA
    Dave,

    Y'know what? As I look back I think that I could play the first two thirds of everything from the Arbans in high School but it wasn't until I got with Vacchiano and Broiles that I can say I almost finished it. I still haven't played through all of the Art of Phrasing and I'll be damned if I still can't through the last Norma variation on one breath. Arrgh! Like Annie, I'm not there yet but I'm gonna get there someday!

    What can I say about Vacchiano that I haven't already said? That sound was a powerful influence on my development as was his personality. I thank G-d I was able to study four years (!) with him.

    ML
     
  8. dbacon

    dbacon Mezzo Piano User

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    Oct 24, 2003
    Scottsdale, AZ.
    Manny,

    Would you say that Mr. Vacchiano and Mr. Broiles were able to imprint (for lack of a better word) their sound, style, approach etc. through Arban (and of course the other works you prepared for them)?

    I had the good fortune to study for a summer with Mr. Jacobs and he used Arban and Schlossberg. I still can't look at one of those pages without hearing him as if he were right next to me, and I still play those pages with (as close to) the sound he imprinted on me. The attack, follow through, phrasing, tempo, timbre, everything.

    With truly great teachers like these, the Arban book becomes magic.

    For a student interested in a career in music, Arban and the best teacher possible are indespensible!

    Of course a great teacher can make the C scale seem like Mozart!! :roll:
     
  9. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

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    Sep 29, 2004
    USA
    "Would you say that Mr. Vacchiano and Mr. Broiles were able to imprint (for lack of a better word) their sound, style, approach etc. through Arban (and of course the other works you prepared for them)?"

    I think that's a great way of looking at it, Dave. Just like a baby eagle and it's mother, eh?

    Happy soaring.

    ML
     
  10. dbacon

    dbacon Mezzo Piano User

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    Oct 24, 2003
    Scottsdale, AZ.
    I was more of an ugly duckling, but I take your point!
     

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