Cornet is flat

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by PatMurphy, Jul 10, 2011.

  1. Dale Proctor

    Dale Proctor Utimate User

    Jul 20, 2006
    Heart of Dixie
    Modern short shank cornet mouthpieces won't (or at least shouldn't) affect the intonation of a cornet, at least not the way you want. The shank taper is the same as the longer cornet mouthpieces, so they won't go in any farther. Ok, but they're shorter, right, so don't they make the horn more sharp? Well, no, because they're short to counteract the way their large, deep cups and huge throats play flat. The only experience I've had with one altering the tuning of a cornet was to make the upper range a little more flat. Now, if you were to find a short shank mouthpiece with a "normal" size throat and cup, then the cornet might play more sharp, due only to the reduced length of the mouthpiece.
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2011
  2. PatMurphy

    PatMurphy Pianissimo User

    Aug 9, 2009
    Cherry Hill NJ
    I thought of that but that would make the entire range still flat when I clolse the tuning slide.

    I find it has a nice full tone when I concentrate on centering the note in the low register, C below the staff and below and up to C in the staff.
    The C in the staff is flat.

    I just returned from playing my Callet Jazz horn, Bach 3C Mpc, for 3 hours all the way to C above the staff was on pitch and completley linear
  3. PatMurphy

    PatMurphy Pianissimo User

    Aug 9, 2009
    Cherry Hill NJ
    Are you saying that deep cup mouthpieces lay flat and shallow ones play sharper?

    JNINWI Piano User

    Apr 26, 2011
    My horn came tuned from the factory so I don’t have to worry about tuning. Maybe you should send it back in and have them tune it ! (Just kidding here, this is a joke we use for sax players, MAN you wanna talk about out of tune !!!) Some of the sax players I’ve played with it doesn’t matter if your in tune of not ! :shhh:
  5. Conntribution

    Conntribution Fortissimo User

    Dec 25, 2010
    Lloyd Harbor NY.
    We used to give no quarter to sax players, especially if they had an attitude.

    We'd {us brass guys} say "that guy can't reed, left your reeding glasses home...Or we'd play on the words pad, neck, keys, etc. A whole host of possibilities.
  6. MFfan

    MFfan Fortissimo User

    Sep 13, 2006
    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    An Olds Ambassdor I used to have and present sibling, Reynolds Medalist cornets needed the tuning slide all the way in to play in tune, with a regular shafted mp, no matter what make. A short shank Kelly 4B and maybe (can't recall) a vintage OLDS allowed the tuning slide to be pulled a fraction of an inch and be in tune, looking more psychologically "normal" to me and allow a bit of forward adjustment.
  7. Dale Proctor

    Dale Proctor Utimate User

    Jul 20, 2006
    Heart of Dixie
    In general, yes, but there are other factors at work, too. A shallow, tight mouthpiece will almost always tend to play sharp, especially near the top of the staff and higher. I know that sounds like the cure for your cornet, but that's not the type of mouthpiece I'd want to use on a cornet.
  8. veery715

    veery715 Utimate User

    Mar 6, 2007
    Ithaca NY
    Did you play the same mouthpiece on the King you traded? If yes, then I would encourage you to try a bunch of other mouthpiecs, of various shank lengths, to see if you can find one which brings the pitch down where it is sharp.

    Another question - does the mouthpiece seat firmly in the receiver, or does it "rock", being either loose at the point where it enters the horn, or loose at the end of the shank and tight at the entry point. If it does not seat, it is a sign that your cornet's receiver taper may differ from that of the mouthpiece - a good sign that there is a mismatch going on and a different mouthpiece might work better.

    One last suggestion. Since you don't have trouble with your trumpet, is maybe your approach to the cornet is too "tight". Put your trumpet away for a week or so and exclusively play the cornet to give you a chance to settle into a more relaxed approach - this may bring your pitch down.
  9. tpsiebs

    tpsiebs Piano User

    Feb 6, 2010
    Randolph, New Jersey
    I don't believe that Martin produced an instument known at a Committee in the days of "high pitch" vs. "low pitch". Cutting the horn would thus be my last resort. Looking into short shank cornet mouthpieces makes sense.

    If the horn plays out of tune with itself and flat overall, have a tech look at the gap between the end of the move and the lead pipe. If, using strips of paper around the shank of the mouthpiece, you can play with the gap and improve the "relative pitch" you've found the culprit.

    Without being insulting, you're not attempting to use a trumpet mouthpiece? I use a Reeves 42 on my '47 Committee and the pitch is excellent.

    Good luck

  10. PatMurphy

    PatMurphy Pianissimo User

    Aug 9, 2009
    Cherry Hill NJ
    1. I notice you have both a Committee Trumpet & Cornet so you should be the expert
    2. I am too old to be insulted. No I am not trying to use a trumpet MPc, since it would not even go in...However I once sttod up to play a cornet that was flat because I had mistakenly put in a flugel MPc.
    3. I can play it in tune but I think it is becasue I regularly bend notes as a "sloppy" player. This became more apparent as I am trying to reform and concentrate on playing on the center of the notes.
    BTW I also find that this cornet is a lot more effort, especially above C than with my Callet trumpet.
    4. Someone asked about the MPc not beeing seated and rocking in the receiver. No, the shaft is not bottoming on the receiver.
    5. I am going to go to Dillon's and try a few other MPc and maybe decide a cornet is just not for me. It will also give me more of an incentive to go back there to try their new Dillon Flugel. Someone stole my Getson and I miss the soft sound I used to play with ballad singers.......
    Any thoughts on the Dillon Flugel?

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