Cutting the 3rd slide on my Conn 40B

Discussion in 'Vintage Trumpets / Cornets' started by mike ansberry, Dec 14, 2016.

  1. mike ansberry

    mike ansberry Forte User

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    I have decided I want to use my 40B as my main axe for rock and funk gigs. But the 3rd valve slide is too long and causes tuning problems. I think back in this era the 3rd slide was made long on purpose to help get the D and C# better in tune, even though it is a kicker slide. I have to push the horn above the center of pitch to get it in tune on notes that use the 2 and 3 combination, and using 3 as an alternate fingering is right out. Any ideas on how much I should cut? I figure I'll take a little off at a time and solder it back together and play it a bit and then take a little more off if necessary.

    I'll be making the 1st slide into a kicker as well.
     
  2. trumpetsplus

    trumpetsplus Fortissimo User

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    Using a tuner, play the note you want to be in tune with your 3rd valve and see how flat it is (in cents - hundredths of a semitone). Then push the slide out to make it flatter. See how much flatter it is with what distance you have moved the slide and use that as a ratio as to how much to shorten the slide. Yes, I know that this gets us into the percentage plus not equalling the percentage minus stuff, but it will give you a good idea.
     
  3. Bflatman

    Bflatman Mezzo Forte User

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    I would consult a tech on this, I play on 4 horns, only one is "modern" in having a pullable third slide, and the other three are traditional with no movable slide (with ring) on the third valve slide.

    One of the traditional is a conn. I have compared all four third valve slides for this extra length that many say exists on the older instruments. I cant detect it on any instrument I have measured.

    I dont say it is mythical, however it should at least be apparrent but im jiggered if I can see any extra length.

    So based on my examinations, cut 0 off.

    I really think a tech should advise you, you cant add any back once its cut off. The tech should be able to tell you how much to cut off and maybe even do it for you.

    Could you not compare your 40b with your bach 37, the bach has a modern "short" slide with pull ring, and the conn 40b has the "longer" slide you want to shorten, both instruments are in Bb so they are otherwise identical, if the conn needs the same length of tubing on the third slide that the bach has, you should be able to measure it directly to see the extra length and make the 2 instruments the same. If you cant see any extra length on the conn third slide, all bets are off.
     
  4. mike ansberry

    mike ansberry Forte User

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    Actually, I am the tech who will do the work. I cut a small piece off the lead pipe on my Eclipse to make it better in tune. Leigh advised me about where to cut and how much to cut.
     
  5. mike ansberry

    mike ansberry Forte User

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    Thanks for the advice, Ivan. What you say makes good sense.
     
  6. Bflatman

    Bflatman Mezzo Forte User

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    Thats cool, im glad your an experienced guy, I wonder if maybe you might like to consider making a frankenhorn and popping a modern third valve slide on the instrument, that gives you the modern tuning option, does that make sense, it sounds like you would be up to the job.
     
  7. mike ansberry

    mike ansberry Forte User

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    Actually, the 3rd valve slide is already set up as a kicker slide. Just too long. I will be turning the top part of the 1st valve slide around to add a first valve kicker as well.
     
  8. jimc

    jimc Mezzo Piano User

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    Or, use your main tuning slide and bring it in the necessary amount to fix your note. And that's the amount right there.
     
  9. Pascalouisiana

    Pascalouisiana Mezzo Piano User

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    Here something else: I have noticed that the intonation's accuracy of an instrument is linked to the mouthpiece used. (Depth and length)
    I know that I don't directly answer your question and actually question your question, but your issue might not be a problem with the trumpet itself but with your mouthpiece.
    Just my $0.02
     
  10. nieuwguyski

    nieuwguyski Forte User

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    Why would you unsolder anything? Can't you just cut off a bit of both male and female slides and shorten the overall length? What's in the way -- the ring mount?
     

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