Does Bach/Selmer use recycled metal?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by thasmo, Sep 2, 2010.

  1. thasmo

    thasmo New Friend

    Sep 4, 2008
    Hi! I've heard from a few sources that the Bach/Selmer company uses recycled metal which is why older model Bach trumpets seem to have better quality. Would anyone be able to elaborate on this?
  2. forrest

    forrest Piano User

    Aug 14, 2007
    St Louis MO
    I'd ask Bach rather than us guessing. They have contact info on their website. Ted Waggoner would be the man to ask.
  3. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

    Oct 26, 2003
    I'm not sure why that would make a difference. The old rumor about the old French Besson trumpets and why they sounded so great was supposedly because their bells were made from recylcled WW I artillery shell casings.

    There are a lot of different factors that go into "quality" - and how exactly do you judge the quality of a metal alloy? It would seem to me that you'd have much larger differences in the quality of an instrument due to general build quality than the quality of the alloy of the brass.
  4. trumpetsplus

    trumpetsplus Fortissimo User

    Jun 11, 2006
    South Salem, NY
    I have heard that early Bachs (New York, Mt Vernon) probably had dirt etc from the factory floor and other contaminants affecting their metal (bell seam hammering etc), and that's what made them sound special. ROFL
  5. gbdeamer

    gbdeamer Forte User

    Oct 16, 2008
    Interesting question. I suppose that differences in the types/purity of the metals used could have an impact on consistency.

    Let us know if you get an answer.
  6. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    What is recycled metal? For those of you that don't know better, brass is an alloy which means you have to have a certain "mix" to get that alloy. Once you melt the metals down and recreate the alloy, they are no longer "recycled. They are "new" again. Metal is not "paper". Recreated metals are just as pure and have the exact same properties as the "originals".

    I think that this is a troublemaker question. What sources do you even listen to before posting rumours? Who starts crap like this? Post your source.
  7. johnwilliam

    johnwilliam New Friend

    Dec 6, 2009

    Any alloyed material produced today most likely uses recycled material in the production process, and it doesn't make one bit of difference in the final product. All raw material purchased by any large manufacturer is procured using a specific material call out, which represents a specific chemistry. The mill supplies this analysis with the material when it's shipped. Some large manufacturers go so far as to verify this chemistry in house upon receiving inspection. I utilize a third party lab for this purpose when necessary to eliminate any perceived bias.

    Bach, or any instrument manufacturer, does not just order "brass," they're ordering a very specific raw material with a know chemistry accurate to within hundreths of a percent. Whether this is produced using recycled material or virgin raw material makes no difference in the final product.

    If anything, because of improved methods of analysis, raw material used today is more consistant than ever from lot to lot.

  8. Sterling

    Sterling Mezzo Forte User

    Oct 22, 2007
    Marcellus, NY
    When Yamaha trumpets were just coming into the US in the late 1960's I heard the same comment. It's just an unfounded excuse to not like a certain horn. The proof is in the playing and construction.
  9. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

    Oct 26, 2003
    Notice the OP hasn't been seen or heard from since they started the thread.
  10. thasmo

    thasmo New Friend

    Sep 4, 2008
    Ok, guys. I'm in the process of getting some answers from different companies. Not that any of your responses weren't good, which they were.

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