Does it sound like a cornet ?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Lionelsax, Oct 23, 2013.

  1. badenia

    badenia Piano User

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    It's been enjoyable reading all the opinions to the question of the forum. The suggestions for different sounds for the horn are very interesting. I detect classical, concert, jazz and pop players.
    My opinion is. soundwise, yes the horn does sound like a cornet. Stylewise it sounds more like a trumpet played with open embouchure and somewhat out of tune - modern jazz style. The fact thet the horn is played by a sax player probaly explains the limitations - many reed player have trouble with flexibility and range on brass and vice versa - maybe it's bite vs pucker..
    Additionally, in my experience each horn seems to have it's own style. One can tell when a Trumpet player is playing a flugelhorn; When a Cornetist is on the trumpet. When a Trumpeter is on a cornet; when a Flugelhorn player is on either of the other 2.
     
  2. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

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    I personally don't think the OP sounds like a cornet player but that is speaking as a Yorkshire (British) Brass Band style cornet player not an American style player. The sound is fine for jazz but to me much more trumpet with a bit of softness to it rather than true cornet. I switch happily between flugel and cornet but have to work to play the trumpet. In fact after an evening on the cornet a month ago then quickly switching to trumpet I felt like throwing the damn thing against the wall. Rather than trying to find a particular sound my advice would be to find your sound. The sound you need to produce, not a sound you can pull off the wall for a given instrument.

    In my case I am now principal cornet in an all comers brass ensemble and that is why I love my DEG cornet. I can produce a bright sound when I play Alexander's Rag Time Band and yet when we play the Largo from the New World Symphony or All in the April Evening I can easily soften it to a traditional British Band sound. (For the Geeks I use a pretty standard Alliance 3B mouthpiece) Now my embouchure subconciously does the work because I was fisrt given a mouthpiece 37 years ago and I am now 40 so my mush probably know what it is doing better than I do. I do not have to think about what my lip is doing on a cornet or flugel whereas I have to on a trumpet.
     
  3. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

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    I've got this problem at the moment, four students two who started (with me) on cornets and two (through school) on trumpets. One lad has decided he is like me a cornet player who might occasionally play the trumpet (thank goodness because he has an amazing sound for an 8 year old), one who is just switching to trumpet and although a little overblowy he is still sounding good. The others who started on trumpet one has difficulty with tuning and not sounding harsh the other has such an over blow he kills his lip if we are not careful. All four have great strengths as players but we had a session of junior ensemble practice the other day and it was obvious which were the cornet players and which were the trumpeters which two could listen, blend, feel the music and tune to the ensemble. Cornets forever!!!!!!!
     
  4. Lionelsax

    Lionelsax Mezzo Piano User

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    That's the sound I would like to get : Jazz Master Jonathan Pugh plays Speak Low on cornet - YouTube
    Well, I think it's impossible and it actually doesn't sound like a trumpet.
    My opinion is that jazz made another sound, it's difficult to make a difference between a classical trumpet and a classical cornet for my ears they quite sound the same.
    For the Haydn Concerto for trumpet, sometimes it's a Eb trumpet or a Eb cornet, there is not a big difference, maybe I'm deaf, I don't know.
    But when the instrument is tuned in Bb, the difference can be heard in the high register, on the cornet it's weak but mysterious, a little bit like a French horn, on the other hand in the high register trumpet is more glorious.
     
  5. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

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    Sorry Pal that is cobblers, a cornet is not really classical as you are defining it and that recording sounds nothing like a Brass Band cornet which is a world away from a classical trumpet and as for the Haydn I have never heard it on a Sop (Eb) cornet although I might be wrong.

    Get your head round the fact that the cornet and trumpet are not just different breeds of the same instrument and you will be getting the idea. You have a shepherds crook cornet which should sound sweet and vocal, google either Philip McCann or James Shepherd for what they are menat to sound like. The sound you want is from a more than likely from a straight model cornet.

    Please learn the difference

    Brass Band (shepherds crook cornet (what I play)) Versatile and beautiful
    American Long Model cornet (straight model) Jazz
    Trumpet Classical
    Eb Cornet Pretty Much Brass Band only
    Eb Trumpet Classical

    That is a generalisation and all the more odious for that but it gives you an idea

    I would suggest for the sound you are aiming for you would be better with a straight model cornet rather than a shepherd's crook model. If you want to be completely technical there is no such thing as a classical cornet but that is a very different can of worms which I am not willing to open at this given moment.
    I stil suggest you find your own sound

    I would also take exception to you statement that a cornet is weak in the upper register. Firstly the cornet is not as easy a blow as a trumpet and tightens up more in the higher register. Put simply why anyone would take this wonderful instrument into the extremes where it gets out of its comfort zone has alway been beyond me. Secondly It was never built to be an extreme instrument.
     
  6. Lionelsax

    Lionelsax Mezzo Piano User

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  7. Lionelsax

    Lionelsax Mezzo Piano User

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    [​IMG]

    This is the man.

    Jonathan Pugh, Cornetist and Trumpeter, Plays Jazz at Third Place Books This Saturday Night « Glenn’s Trumpet Notes


    And this is an interesting video, no one talks about him and it is not a straight long cornet and it doesn't sound like a trumpet, it is a huge sound...
    http://youtu.be/KLnLDs98dkU



    And this is the same guy with a trumpet : http://youtu.be/62yDkJMMhkM


    And again with a cornet : http://youtu.be/PcHM17C8s_g
     
  8. rankamateur

    rankamateur Mezzo Forte User

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    Merry Ol' England
    How about John Wallace?
     
  9. rankamateur

    rankamateur Mezzo Forte User

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    Merry Ol' England
  10. rankamateur

    rankamateur Mezzo Forte User

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    Merry Ol' England
    A British cornet is a completely different playing style that you don't get with an American cornet. Putting it succinctly, long cornet = trumpet. Same feel, same style, same sound. And it's played that way in the US. I can't put it into words exactly. It isn't meant to sound brash and loud, but more sweet, restrained and contained. It's not so 'here I am look at me!' but more 'let's all sit together and sing a melodious song, just for us to hear'. See. I can't really explain it in words.
     

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