Double tonguing problems

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by jfishfinder, Aug 31, 2015.

  1. jfishfinder

    jfishfinder New Friend

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    Hi, I'm a sophomore in high school and recently received and audition packet that has forced me to learn how to double tongue. I have tried before but was really bad at it so I gave up..... now that I have to learn how I've run into a couple problems. When I tongue with the back of my tongue it isn't crisp and comes out sounding really bad. I can also barely play quarter notes using the back of m tongue. I need some advice on how to make to tonguing crisper and be able to play faster. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!!! Thanks in advance.
     
  2. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

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    Where exactly is the 'back of your tongue'? ie how far back from the tip.
     
  3. jfishfinder

    jfishfinder New Friend

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    about 2 inches
     
  4. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

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    Where's the tip of your tongue relative to your teeth on the 'tu'? And do you articulate with the tip of your tongue or further back?
     
  5. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    This might be a bit wordy, but it's relevant, so hopefully you'll bear with me and take the time to read it. (I've actually posted it before, but I can't seem to locate it.)

    I went to a drumming event put on by the Percussive Arts Society, and one of the clinics I caught the tail end of was a percussion clinic being taught by a collegiate level percussion instructor. He recounted a story of when he was first in college as a young music major, and having some trouble with his drum roll, he approached his instructor and asked him how he could improve it. He was thinking his instructor was going to impart to him some sage words of wisdom, or give him some trick that would make his roll better. (In a way, I suppose he did.)

    His instructor said, "If you want to improve your roll, then roll - 10 minutes a day, every day."

    The lesson to be taken away is that sometimes there isn't a trick or tip that's automatically going to give it to you - most of the time you're going to have to knuckle down, and work on that specific aspect of your technique in a very focused way so you can dial in the minute changes that are necessary for you to improve the technique and build muscle memory.

    So with that said, if you want to improve your double-tonguing, then double-tongue - 10 minutes a day, every day. (And don't use exercises out of a book - do VERY basic double tonguing so you can focus in and get a real feel for what's going on between you, the mouthpiece, and the trumpet.)

    There is no trick - you're going to have to work for it, and your progress may not be fast, although I'd submit that if you do what I've suggested, and you work your doubling tonguing in a focused way, it will improve faster than you might think.

    On a side note, at this stage I wouldn't bother (yet) with working specifically on K-tonguing. Get to where you can do a semi-decent double-tongue first before you move to working on K-tonguing because chances are you need to improve your air usage first, and articulation exercises are one of the paths toward that. Once you get your air moving well, you will have productive practices where you can work K-tonguing.
     
  6. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    Yet another approach. I'm sure one of our tame doctors will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the tongue, oz. for oz. is the strongest muscle in our body, and is already highly trained. One approach to training the double tongue is to start on page 175 of the Arban's method, and play one after the other until the tongue starts stuttering. Try "du-gu" as a syllable at first, blow through the notes, let your tongue "melt" in your mouth, practice daily and wait for the miracle to happen.

    Have fun!
     
  7. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    It's a bit of a different approach, but I think that some players get distracted by the page when they are working on technique, and progress actually comes more quickly if they practice specific areas of technique with just the trumpet - that way, there is nothing to distract them from focusing in on how it really feels so they can make the small changes to improve it.
     
  8. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

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    Took nearly 50 years in my case. Until a chance comment by CornyAndy about regional dialects..........
     
  9. BigDub

    BigDub Fortissimo User

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    Do you have any trumpet playing friends or a teacher who have the double tonguing down? Most likely you do, so try to get them to spend some one on one time with you. It's a little hard in this format to see what you're doing and hear how it sounds.
    One of my Trumpet player friends is hands down a better player than me, but not at double tonguing, in fact, he is so much faster at single tonguing than I am, because double tonguing comes so easy to me, I just use it readily, but he avoids it, and this is why his single tonguing has gotten to be so efficient. Kind of avoiding the real issue, in a sense.
    You will get through this, but you need one on one help....do seek someone out
     
  10. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    I see your point, but I find we humans, by and large, pretty much a lazy and indolent lot. That is why I prefer the structure of Arbans and the idea of trying to make it farther every day.

    What is humbling for me is to try double-tonguing while whistling. I just can't make it work.
     

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