Double Tonguing Questions

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by wezley, Nov 2, 2011.

  1. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    I think that oo like in book is close to Ö.

    Believe me, a missing Ö is not going to kill your playing.
     
  2. The Weez

    The Weez Piano User

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    I always had trouble double tounguing until I started playing The Chicken Dance in a polka band. After playing it tu-ku about a million times in different keys and registers I can now play as fast as the drummer can possibly bang it out! And I agree w Rowuk - all the other syllables are easier, and it's really helped me in ALL my playing.
     
  3. coolerdave

    coolerdave Utimate User

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    There's the Arban's and there is playing in a polka band .... yep pretty well sums it up :)
     
  4. richtom

    richtom Forte User

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    From Scheherazade, some examples of VERY fast and precise double tonguing from Frank Kaderabek and friends in the Philadelphia Orchestra. Rimsky Korsakov Scheherazade Mvt 4 Part 2; Phil Orchestra Ormandy - YouTube
    Yes, boys and girls, they are right with the snare drum - especially the solo Frank plays at 1:33. It is also played softly, which separates them that can from them that can't.

    And now -even thought we are not discussing triple tonguing - here is a perfect example of the wicked demands Ravel placed on orchestral musicians. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hTOrXJgbZY
    Start at approximately 5:40 and listen to what the horns and the trumpets must do. For those who do not know orchestral music well, the 1st and 2nd trumpets pass this vicious passage back and forth.

    Rich T.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2011
  5. operagost

    operagost Forte User

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    I like french "tu" (roughly english "tee") because it helps me keep the tip of my tongue planted behind my lower teeth. Anchoring the tip of the tongue was the solution for my double-tonguing problems, along with Lee Loughnane who did it after DECADES of performing. Others have their own solutions, although I would be surprised if using the tip of the tongue to actually release the air worked for anyone. It's incredibly slow, and yet it seems that every non-brass-major grade school instructor has learned it this way and passes the troublesome habit on to their students.
     
  6. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    Not like falling off the high d at the end of the Christmas Oratorio will!
     
  7. BrotherBACH

    BrotherBACH Piano User

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    Double tonguing was one of the first things I wanted to learn on the comeback trail. The Green Hornet theme has been in my head since I was a kid.

    Since I found it very difficult and it is so recent, I will give own experience, not advice.

    I would practice the double-tonguing syllables off-horn, endlessly. I would try to go as long as I could before either messing up or the back of the tongue getting achy. I gradually worked up in speed.

    On the horn, I would take a note that was simply comfortable (i.e., midline G) and VERY slowly and deliberately alternate between a Tu attack and a Ku attack until they could not be distinguished. Then, I would gradually speed up. As I got better, I realized how much strength and coordination was required from the back of the tongue, so I would pick short exercises just to play it entirely with a Ku attack.

    At this point, off horn, I am now double tonguing while whistling to get the feeling of lightly interrupting the air and speeding up my coordination. All of the sudden, all these things came together, and I could slowly double tongue an etude, which I found very arduous on the corners. So, there was another period of my chops getting used to the work.

    I am now double-tonguing where in the notes change and where they don’t. The later I have found more difficult. Another person who I have practiced with finds the same thing.

    I always try to push my speed but never at the expense of clarity and accuracy. There is some double tonguing for an arrangement of “O Canada” that I have to play at a Remembrance Day ceremony tomorrow. It is faster than I ever practice but it just comes.

    BrotherBACH
     

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