Embrasure development?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Invisible-Bob, Jun 11, 2011.

  1. Myszolow

    Myszolow Pianissimo User

    86
    2
    Apr 23, 2011
    LOL. GMonady said he's been playing 40 years. That's 480 months. :D
     
  2. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

    8,612
    2,128
    Sep 20, 2009
    New York State USA
    dude - you aren't from Australia are you? 1 note for each month is reasonable progression for someone who is just starting the instrument. there are limitation to the instrument and it's design, as well as human limitations.ROFL
    don't pick on GMonady -- I think in one post he stated he has a high A below the Double High C, but can't get the DHC to come in clearly--- and that (after 40 years) is a tell tale sign of -- he isn't practicing enoughROFL
     
  3. TrumpetMD

    TrumpetMD Fortissimo User

    3,503
    2,307
    Oct 22, 2008
    Maryland
    The problem is that people use term "capacity" is used in two different ways.

    Medically speaking, gmonady is correct. He gives a nice summary of lung physiology in this thread. A person's lung volumes and lung capacities will NOT change by playing the trumpet.

    However, aerobic conditioning (which includes trumpet playing) can increase the efficiency of the accessory muscles of respiration. This is sometimes referred to as "lung capacity". But this is a misnomer. It actually has nothing to do with lung capacities or lung volumes. Instead, it has to do with the efficiency of the accessory muscles of respiration. This increased efficiency can show up as an increased FEV1 and FEF50. This is what was reported in the article that KT referenced.

    BTW, I'd take the finding of increased respiratory symptoms with a grain of salt. Such quasai-experimental studies are subject to errors, and would need to be verified independently. We also don't know if they used matched controls. In addition, this increase in respiratory symptoms, if it is true, could easily be the result of GERD, which can be exacerbated when playing a wind instrument, and can often lead to resipiratory symptoms (hoarseness, chronic cough, sinusitits, and even asthma).
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2011
  4. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

    8,612
    2,128
    Sep 20, 2009
    New York State USA
    Cool - thanks for the 2nd opinion TrumpetMD -- semantics and medical terminology aside -- if you aren't experiencing respiratory problems by playing a "wind" instrument -- then it is likely to enhance your breathing.
    Who knows maybe the results in some of the medical journals correlate to people being more conscious of their breathing -- and of course breathing properly. After all if you are being tested for respiratory effects -- one is more apt to sit up straight, breath deeper, and be more conscious of breathing -- even though it is pretty much an involuntary process anyhow.
     
  5. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

    18,129
    9,306
    Jan 28, 2011
    Dayton, Ohio
    A consult is a consult. A second opinion is fine, it's your investment, but my consult has been submitted and billed.

    You leave a novice to do the search for free, and the novice gets what they pay for, nothing.

    KT read your initial post carefully. You stated the effects on residual volume. My review stands, none of the articles you find effect residual volume. Most respiratory therapies benefit some component of respiratory function, but NOT residual volume, which was the term you used for the respiratory point you were trying to make .

    Read again my reply carefully, it is not medical, it is physiological, more to the physical side of breathing. I am taking rowuk's most excellent lead who is so eloquent at reporting physics of the trumpet. I am extending the physics to the other side of the lips.

    My point, if you read it carefully, is that you use expiratory muscle to develop psi that is especially useful for enhancing the valve function the lips play when they control air flow as they are compressed onto a brass mouthpiece. Reed instruments, open mouth instruments such as the harmonica, do not use the lips for this function. Therefore the psi generated from the total lung capacity has a very important role to play for the brass player. No medicine, just physics. This concept actually complements the video you posted on another thread.

    So do re-read my post above a consult request has been answered, you have my fee.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2011
  6. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

    18,129
    9,306
    Jan 28, 2011
    Dayton, Ohio
    KT, that high A below the double high C is the range I can achieve with consistency on my FLUGELHORN. I have been playing consistent double high Cs on my trumpet for several years now, but that was NEVER a goal, it just happened.

    My point as to the 40 years is that I am still progressing, on other techniques and skills. There is more to life than just building range, or to getting to the double high C. One should never stop progressing upon achieving a goal, rather at that time, priority is toward setting the next realistic goal.
     
  7. Peter McNeill

    Peter McNeill Utimate User

    7,072
    4,666
    Jan 30, 2009
    Melbourne Australia
    Back on Topic:
    Hi Bob, Welcome to TM.

    I understand that you are new to the trumpet, and have invested in a Top of the Line Yamaha. That is a heavy investment for a first trumpet, so you are obviously committed to it.

    Firstly, get a teacher quickly to help you to make the sound, and to teach you how to maintain that F1 sport car you're driving.

    It will take time to develop a sound, and get to play a tune. It will happen a lot more quickly with a teacher, he/she can see you play and correct things immediately. Weekly lessons and then 30 mins practice minimum per day will get you started.

    All the very best, and keep us advised of the progress.
    Cheers
    Peter
     
  8. Peter McNeill

    Peter McNeill Utimate User

    7,072
    4,666
    Jan 30, 2009
    Melbourne Australia
    BTW - Learning trumpet is not a 100mete race, it is a marathon with continued effort over a life-time of learning. Can we ask how old you are, and do you have access to a teacher?

    The information supplied by most posts above about goals, practice routines etc, can come later. Enjoy the horn, and do not get frustrated with it, it will challenge you the whole way.

    Cheers again
     
  9. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

    18,129
    9,306
    Jan 28, 2011
    Dayton, Ohio
    I disagree that goals, practice routines... can come later. Setting the goal to building the embouchure, from my reading of the first post, is task one. And that includes building a practice routine that includes respiratory support to enhancing embouchure function, the very subject of the posts above.

    And in setting goals, it is important to note that this one will take time. How much time? No one can give a definitive answer, but with the above advice, the goal will be achieved much sooner than later.
     
  10. Myszolow

    Myszolow Pianissimo User

    86
    2
    Apr 23, 2011
    Re: Embouchure development?

    No. UK. :-)

    I'm sure it is. Just having a little fun. :play:
     

Share This Page