Favorite type of water key?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by abtrumpet, Mar 6, 2010.

  1. SteveRicks

    SteveRicks Fortissimo User

    Aug 15, 2009
    My favorite are the side keys found on Olds SUpers (not sure what they are techniocally called -Mendez, are you out there?) Shoving from the side seems so much easier than the "in line with bell" keys on Bachs or the trombone like keys on Olds Ambassadors that yougo at from underneath. Hands down, the super is the easiest in my book. Love the one horn I have with Amado keys-only thing I don't kike about the horn are the Amados. :)
  2. ogauge47

    ogauge47 Piano User

    Dec 26, 2008
    Metro Detroit, Michigan
    F.E. Olds trombone style water keys, both Ambassador and Super flavors
  3. nieuwguyski

    nieuwguyski Forte User

    Aug 9, 2004
    Santa Cruz County, CA
    Conn Vocabell water keys. Functionally they're standard lever water keys, and they're probably not the most effective at removing the moisture. But they're cool.
  4. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    My favorite water key is shark# (sharp). My least favorite is coral b (flat).
  5. B15M

    B15M Forte User

    Dec 30, 2003
    Monroe Ct.
    I took a look at the Saturn. It's a nice idea.

    I think the idea of the Amado is to have a small opening. There are waves bouncing around in the trumpet. Depending on the note, the wave can hit on the opening for the water drain. If there is a hole, it will (could) change the tuning.

    The Saturn looks like that hole is big so it will work well to drain the water.

    On my Monette I have taken apart the Amado many times to clean it. The hole is pretty small.
  6. trumpetsplus

    trumpetsplus Fortissimo User

    Jun 11, 2006
    South Salem, NY
    I find that trumpets normally play better with an Amado style water key rather than the traditional lever style water key. This is why I have used Amados or similar on all my trumpets.

    Historically, the justification for Amado has been that their is no "void" at the nipple, so there is no extra turbulence; however Yamaha and others have solved that from time to time with specially shaped corks with a nipple.

    I believe that the difference which affects the playing is that the lever key exerts a pressure on the tubing at the "spud" and a torsional (twisting) force at the hinge of the lever. All the Amado style does is add mass which the lever style does as well. Pressure-wise, it is a self-contained system.
  7. Markie

    Markie Forte User

    Jan 4, 2009
    Clarksburg, WV
    I've used both.
    I like the standard water keys that use cork pads.
    Everything is fairly replacable (usually for free or really cheap
    I do not like amado water keys because of the following:
    1)They will stick in the open position (I've had it to happen during practice and it also happened during a gig)
    2)The amado water key doesn't let all the water out and I have to pull my slide to empty it.
  8. abtrumpet

    abtrumpet Pianissimo User

    Nov 14, 2009
    Anyone want to explain saturn keys to me? :p

    You're supposed to regularly oil them.
  9. ChopsGone

    ChopsGone Forte User

    Jan 26, 2009
    Northern California
    Saturns are my first choice, lever type (especially Olds trombone-style) second, Amados and their imitations as a last resort. Saturns work well, they're the lowest-maintenance of the bunch, the don't leak, and they're extremely well-made. A lever type with decent cork is perfectly acceptable, and I'd rather deal with occasionally changing corks than put up with the higher maintenance and occasional leaks of Amados.
  10. oldlou

    oldlou Forte User

    Aug 28, 2005
    Grand Rapids, Mi.

    Have you had a 'competent' tech check for a burr in the tubing that is formed by poor drilling technique or a dull drill bit in the manufacture of your horn? If there is a burr,( not at all uncommon ), this forms a dam that absolutely will not allow the water valve to completely drain the affending water in the tuning slide crook. This has the additional effect of retaining that acidic liquid in the leaderpipe and tuning slide crook which will eventually cause the dreaded redrot. A simple removal of the nipple and a very slight reaming of the hole cures all of those ills.

    My favorite water valve is the side lever style as used on some Olds, Getzen, York, etc.. I have seen too many horns that the musicians claimed went out of tune every time that they drained the water. A side lever obviates that, and is much more handy to use.


Share This Page