featuring the trumpet

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by songbook, Jun 19, 2014.

  1. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Dr. Mark, were all those college kids playing Strad 37's with 1.5c mpcs? ;-)
     
  2. songbook

    songbook Piano User

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    Dr Mark, you've made some interesting points, as usual.
     
  3. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    I think that you all have a VERY selective look of the past. I'll bet Al Hirt did not sell as many albums or get the radio air play time that Chris Botti (or pick any other player) does.

    For listeners with a goal, there is plenty of air time for great trumpet solos - especially in films.
    Internet radio:
    NRK Jazz
    Linn Jazz
    Audiophile Jazz
     
  4. Dr.Mark

    Dr.Mark Mezzo Forte User

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    Hi rowuk,
    You stated:
    "I think that you all have a VERY selective look of the past."
    -------------
    Everyone has a selective look or perspective of the past. However, Comparing Botti and Hirt is a bit unfair. The method of marketing and music dispersal has grown exponentally Cd's Itunes, internet radio. You would need to measure Hirt to Botti in some reasonable manner (possibly use a z-score to compare. They're handy when comparing apples and oranges) Also, NRK, Linn, Audiophile? If I ask the average person what this is they'll probably say a communicable disease. These sites can not compare to NBC/Microsoft, Itunes, and other big Internet sites. Also, you're speaking of jazz. Today's listener wants a beat (Beyonce, Grande, Miranda Lambert, Paisley, Maroon 5) , not a station that feels like each song is a study in theory.
    As for a listener with a goal, I'm not sure what that means. My goal when I listen is to be entertained. Yes, I like Coltrane, and Miles and all the others. I also like opera, polka and music from India. However, if you want to know why trumpets have fallen from the spotlight, look as far as your radio and reread my post.
     
  5. Dr.Mark

    Dr.Mark Mezzo Forte User

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    Hi tobylou8,
    Yes!! They mostly played Bach Strads.
    Dr.Mark
     
  6. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.Mark View Post
    Hi rowuk,
    You stated:
    "I think that you all have a VERY selective look of the past."
    -------------
    Everyone has a selective look or perspective of the past. However, Comparing Botti and Hirt is a bit unfair. The method of marketing and music dispersal has grown exponentally Cd's Itunes, internet radio. You would need to measure Hirt to Botti in some reasonable manner (possibly use a z-score to compare. They're handy when comparing apples and oranges) Also, NRK, Linn, Audiophile? If I ask the average person what this is they'll probably say a communicable disease. These sites can not compare to NBC/Microsoft, Itunes, and other big Internet sites. Also, you're speaking of jazz. Today's listener wants a beat (Beyonce, Grande, Miranda Lambert, Paisley, Maroon 5) , not a station that feels like each song is a study in theory.
    As for a listener with a goal, I'm not sure what that means. My goal when I listen is to be entertained. Yes, I like Coltrane, and Miles and all the others. I also like opera, polka and music from India. However, if you want to know why trumpets have fallen from the spotlight, look as far as your radio and reread my post.


    Doc, I really don't get you. Why do you insist on copying my posts? Sometimes I think you are stalking me just to argue. Fine!

    Why should I reread your post? Think that I didn't understand it the first time? Maybe you think that I didn't consider it important enough to comment? No comment!


    What is unfair? Did the average Joe in 1965 know who Al Hirt or Raphael Mendez was? Of course not - no different than Botti or Guy Parker today. All of them have a more or less "selective" market as I posted. Who cares if the mass market consumer doesn't care if it is mp3 32kB, stolen, borrowed or found on the street corner?

    My point is: trumpets haven't fallen from the spotlight. We had Mendez and Hirt back then and Marsalis, Botti and a bunch of others today. In the Classical scene we had Philip Jones, Heinz Zickler, Ed Tarr and Don Smithers back then, André in between and all sorts today from Mnozil and Eklund to Antonsen, Balsom, Nakariakov, Lindemann, Vizutti, Helseth. The selective view of the past simply means that the percentages of the Hirts to the whole market being similar to the Bottis and the whole market simply doesn't hold water if we really look at how lucky that we are today. Claiming that the quantity OR quality is less today is more or less ignoring what is really happening in the trumpet world.

    There is more trumpet music proportionally available today than ever before. Period. Claiming anything else is VERY selective.
     
  7. songbook

    songbook Piano User

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    The point that I was trying to make was that I miss a song featuring the trumpet that I can whistle while doing my chores. Playing scales very fast and high does not get the average person in a singing mood.
     
  8. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    if I might mention my friend Nicole Sasser ( Nicole Sasser | Trumpeter, Vocalist, Entertainer ) -- who plays several "hits" in her shows on cruise boat gigs aka "Feels So Good" the popular Chuck Mangione hit from the 80's. Nicole also writes some of her own music --- but if you know her or view her even on YOUTUBE -- -then you will find a few very distinctive traits, and I will mention Trombone Shorty in the same sentence. THESE PEOPLE are entertainers, yes they play the trumpet, and yes they are good, or at least good enough for continual gigs. BOTH trombone Shorty and my friend Nicole also SING, and ENTERTAIN as well as play the trumpet. I think the trumpet has become a PART of someone's persona instead of being the TOTAL PERSONA like it may have been in the past!!!!! --- just my opinion, and you can find the Botti's, the Severensen's who are known for only trumpet ---- but I say, we find other's who are known as ENTERTAINERS first, as well as trumpet players!!!!
     
  9. Dr.Mark

    Dr.Mark Mezzo Forte User

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    Doc, I really don't get you. Why do you insist on copying my posts? Sometimes I think you are stalking me just to argue. Fine!
    -----
    No you didn't!! Because when I'm responding to a post, the info is right there, it's not back on page (for ex.pg. 3). and as for stalking you, no, you're just too damned ugly.
    -----
    Why should I reread your post? Think that I didn't understand it the first time? Maybe you think that I didn't consider it important enough to comment? No comment!
    -----
    No I don't think you fully read my post and just glanced over it. How do you compare the draw of Maroon 5 to Shorty or Marsalis. How do you compare their pocketbooks.
    ----
    What is unfair? Did the average Joe in 1965 know who Al Hirt or Raphael Mendez was? Of course not - no different than Botti or Guy Parker today. All of them have a more or less "selective" market as I posted. Who cares if the mass market consumer doesn't care if it is mp3 32kB, stolen, borrowed or found on the street corner?
    -----
    I beg to differ, In 1965, Al Hirt was often found on "main stream TV & radio" often on variety shows as was Mendez. That's not selective.
    ----
    My point is: trumpets haven't fallen from the spotlight. We had Mendez and Hirt back then and Marsalis, Botti and a bunch of others today. In the Classical scene we had Philip Jones, Heinz Zickler, Ed Tarr and Don Smithers back then, André in between and all sorts today from Mnozil and Eklund to Antonsen, Balsom, Nakariakov, Lindemann, Vizutti, Helseth. The selective view of the past simply means that the percentages of the Hirts to the whole market being similar to the Bottis and the whole market simply doesn't hold water if we really look at how lucky that we are today. Claiming that the quantity OR quality is less today is more or less ignoring what is really happening in the trumpet world.
    -----
    You're right, trumpets haven't fallen from the spotlight. The spotlight has fallen from them. At one time Harry James, Al Hirt, and many many other instrumentalists were big in the eyes of the general populace KEY WORDS "general populace". The people you mentioned, collectively make as much per year as Jay-Z and Beyonce make in a month and that's not counting outside ventures. The instrumentalist has been replaced by the vocalist, plain and simple. It began with Sinatra and hasn't showed signs of slowing. If you wish to argue this point or the original question as to why we don't hear trumpets on the radio or in the general populace anymore, fine. But you'll have to do it with someone else.
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    There is more trumpet music proportionally available today than ever before. Period. Claiming anything else is VERY selective.
    ---
    I just don't understand your use of "very selective." Granted there's more available but who's buying?
    Hope this helps
    Dr.Mark
     
  10. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Okaaaay, Ah, I, Umm, I was gonna say "Rocky" or "Superman" or (this will get 'em) "Light Cavalry Overture". If I whistle a trumpet tune it's usually cause my lips are tired from buzzing trumpet tunes .
     

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