High notes- yes another topic, positioning help

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by orcanels, Nov 7, 2010.

  1. orcanels

    orcanels New Friend

    Sep 20, 2010
    Ok, so in the upper register everyone says, AIR SPEED, TOngue postition, right ok, got it, and no pressure on the mouthpiece, ok sure

    how do you get the airspeed up? and what position is your mouth and tongue in, can someone please explain how to get the air to speed up without just blowing hard?

    thianks :thumbsup:
  2. keehun

    keehun Piano User

    Feb 4, 2010
    Some will say it just comes with more experience and practice. The more you study the instrument and better you get with it, your air will become more efficiently used, and that includes more appropriate air speeds for the notes.
  3. TrumpetMonk

    TrumpetMonk Pianissimo User

    Jul 22, 2009
    West virginia
    Probably the best answer I've heard keehun. There is deffinitly no magic bullet to range, other than practice.
    keehun likes this.
  4. Satchmo Brecker

    Satchmo Brecker Piano User

    Jul 19, 2010
    I appreciate keeshun trying to help, but honestly for newbies like the OP and myself, the blanket "just have to practice" or the "just get a teacher" lines aren't very helpful. It's a given we'll practice, and it's a given if one can afford it, a teacher is a good thing.

    Anywho, my two cents from what I've learned is that saying/thinking syllables is key. The higher you go the more your tongue should move from "ah" to "ee". And that focuses the airstream, kinda like those videos you may have seen where the smoke blows over the wing of a plane. The squeezing of the airstream over the curve makes the air move faster (and decreases pressure causing lift.) That in combo with breath support, lip strength, etc. will make getting into the upper registers doable over time.

    And I'm assuming that the more we practice the less effort will be needed to focus the airstream. (I'm hoping that's the case because if it's not my tongue will go through the roof of my mouth right before my head explodes!)
  5. EdMann

    EdMann Mezzo Forte User

    Sep 20, 2007
    Los Angeles
    "And I'm assuming that the more we practice the less effort will be needed to focus the airstream. "
    Yes and no. It has to be good facetime. If your sound begins to deteriorate and/or your face is getting tired, you're overdoing it. Step back, take a break, use the power of rest and work on something else while keeping your sound where you want it. This is the key to what I've discovered and it's worked. Do not play tired. You will sound tired.

  6. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    I do not say air speed because it is a lie, I do not say tongue position because it doesn't work for many and I don't say no pressure because it is a lie too.

    You cannot get the airspeed up. Trumpets do not work that way. The lips function best at equilibrium. The amount of air that we use when playing has more to do with us not hyperventilating or suffocating rather than what the chops need.

    The tongue position is not something that you just place and go. It requires many years of intelligent practice to find what works for you and then perfect it.

    No pressure just can't happen, and for most minimal pressure is not reasonable because they do not have the time and dedication to work it out.

    The solution is a solid daily routine and continued monitoring from the qualified!
  7. trumpetnick

    trumpetnick Fortissimo User

    Nov 16, 2005
    Vidin, Bulgaria

    Can you elaborate more on the above? I often feel like suffocating when trying to extend my range in the stratosphere, which often results in an urge to cough in the middle of a phrase.
  8. SteveRicks

    SteveRicks Fortissimo User

    Aug 15, 2009
    I'm beginning to think you are a pretty smart guy Rowuk. I've never understood the air speed bit. Sounds like one is trying to take off in a plane. Hook the horn up to a compressor and shoot more air in-were fast. Does the pitch go up? Still, I would appreciate any insights others may give to help us understand the idea of air speed.
  9. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

    Sep 20, 2009
    New York State USA
    Of course -- I don't have the final answer yet to notes above high C. Only to say that is seems to be a combination of "faster" air, and facial muscles to hold a "small" aperture --- and good lip vibration --((less mpc pressure holding it to your face, but still having the lips relaxed enough to vibrate, and the face muscles strong enough to hold it all together))
    An example -- Coming back 22 months ago -- it was difficult to get a G on the space above the staff, now it is "easy".

    maybe that's why some of these guys on TM -- keep saying relax, cause after so long of hitting the high notes -- it is "easy"

    YouTube - kfiala01's Channel

    YouTube - Maynard Ferguson plays "Maynard Ferguson"

    YouTube - Trumpet High Notes By Former Maynard Ferguson Player

    those videos won't exactly show you how to do the high notes --- but - if you watch, you can see elevated shoulders (lungs), good posture, a more efficient air stream -- and the air compressor using HIGHER pressure air.
  10. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

    Sep 20, 2009
    New York State USA
    if my links come up ok on the thread -- you should see Keith Fiala demonstrate the air compressor -- ok , apparently the for the air compressor you will have to go to the Keith Fiala link and scroll down for the air compressor demonstration -- that's the best I can do.
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2010

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