I just don't get it

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Trumpetgeek142, Oct 20, 2008.

  1. brem

    brem Mezzo Forte User

    Sep 13, 2007
    Quebec City, QC, Canada
    At the same time, he should probably make his own fortune. Find a band where you can fully develop. Start a small jazz combo, be inventif. Show them you're better cause you're inventive, not a sheep. :play::thumbsup:
  2. ccNochops

    ccNochops Piano User

    Sep 30, 2006
    White Marsh, VA
    Hey TG142, got to ask yourself one simple question, are you playing the horn for yourself? Does not matter where you sit if you are. Your part, whether it's lead or 4th, is part of the trumpet section. Play the horn, not the chair.....bands will come & go....chuck @ 52
  3. RX-2Fan

    RX-2Fan Pianissimo User

    Oct 19, 2008
    Tampa FL
    here is my advice. dont let it get to you. become friends with the freshmen thats uncle is the band director and have fun. after you get used to it you really wont care.
  4. DavidLarson

    DavidLarson New Friend

    Sep 23, 2008
    North Vancouver, Canada
    As an orchestra conductor, I would often ask strong players to play other parts- strong violinists to lead the 2nd violins, a strong 2nd trumpet as well as a strong 1st. This gives experience in leading a section, as well as helping other players. I would always let the person, and the other section members know that the player is in this position to help the group, and that it is not a demotion or a reflection of poor playing, but rather good playing, helping others, including the group, and a reflection on the persons character as well. The next concert they would usually have a solo or lead part. It seemed to build community spirit, and a desire to really help the section. I would not do it without the cooperation of the player.
    On the other hand, if it is sheer favouritism, remember that the whole musical community can be like that- certain people are in, and certain people are out, in certain groups. Be the best that you can be, and challenge yourself to improve all aspects of your playing and personality. Know that your placement is not a permenant thing, and maybe consider putting together a group that will feature some of your work. Keep the emphasis on improving yourself, because you cannot necessarily change the world around you- who said it had to be fair? Just do your best, and the rest will sort itself out eventually.
  5. Bob Grier

    Bob Grier Forte User

    May 4, 2007
    Greensboro, NC
    It's a shame there are directors that seat on grade level and not merit. I know this will sound harsh but he is an idiot. Nothing kills motivation in a young student then this situation. have you talked to anyone else about this? When I was 12 years old my HS director sat me in the 1st trumpet section ahead of upper classmen. we were sitted on merit and ability. are there other bands you can play with? Community or church groups?
    Can you tranfer to another school?

    Bob G
  6. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    We need to UNBASH this band director that has not given us his side.

    I think the attitude that only the FIRST trumpet is desirable is the WRONG message.

    I know that we are brought up to recognize winners and losers. That stinks! Music needs qualified players on EVERY stand. I think that Trumpetgeek has a lesson to learn here.

    Trumpetgeek, I am not getting on your case. I can only tell you that some of the most fun times I have playing (and I have been doing it for more than 40 years) are when I play second. The stuff that one can do for the section sound from the middle are MUCH greater than from the outside (harmonically speaking).

    Maybe the music world made a mistake by labeling the parts first, second and third...........?
  7. Solar Bell

    Solar Bell Moderator Staff Member

    May 11, 2005
    Metro Detroit
    I have to disagree with you Robin. I am with Bob Grier on this.

    Music is a place where you need to be rewarded on merit, not seniority.

    I play in many big bands, I also play all the parts on occasion.

    I don't know of any pros that I play with who were held back.

    "Yes I was a solid 2nd and third player throughout high school and college"...I don't hear that in the professional groups I play with.

    A young high school player that works to be the best in his school should take that chair. Learn to play the lead/first parts and become a leader. Chances are when he gets to college he will likely sit lower in the section and work his way again to the top.

    THat's where he will become a great all around player.

    To keep a student back or hold him down beneath his qualifications will damper his enthusiasm to continue and strive to be the best.

    Sorry, but in the pro world, you DO want the best in your bands.

    I think the high school director is completely out of line.

    If the student is the best...reward him with placement.

    His college audition doesn't want to hear him say, 'Well I was in the 2nd cornet section, but I was actually better than the guys on first. My director just wanted someone else to play that part."

    I wouldn't believe him and neither would anyone else.

    The kid should have his chair.

  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    there is no issue with "going for it". Still, Trumpetgeek is a freshman, still has plenty of time and we do not know the band directors side. He tried twice to get a first chair and was not successful. There may be more to the story!

    The worst thing that could happen would be to become an unprofessional "bitter" second player. Obviously there is an issue that needs attending to, Trumpetgeek alone can figure out what that is and do what is necessary. The best course of action is to dig in, develop the qualities that give the band director no other choice.

    Characteristics other than playing that "may" have influenced the band directors decision:
    attitude - this is a big issue that covers pride, conceitedness, cooperative nature, team qualities, etc
    ability to judge ones own limits
    opinions of other classmates/section mates

    Naturally, each player decides what is good for them. I read that Trumpetgeek has told us about the bad qualities of certain other players, but no mention has been made if he considers ANY of the other players to be worthy of having a "better" position.
    Nope, I think paying your dues is not a bad concept and that starts with a big picture of yourself - much more than just playing ability!
  9. Dave king

    Dave king New Friend

    Oct 23, 2008
    When first went to college aged 20 to study trumpet I had never even held one as i auditioned on the cornet.
    One stuck up idiot took every opportunity to take the micky out of me. I worked 5 hours a day learnt to transpose and got to know the different styles. Second year we had to audition for every concert and i knocked this guy of the first chair and stayed there till i left winning the prize for the best trumpet and a second for best orchestral player in the college, the only brass player to ever win it.
    I only mention this to show you that talent and a lot of work will put you there eventually.

    I also agree with what a previous guy said, you do need strong players on all parts or the band just sounds duff.

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