Improving articulations in the extremes of one's range

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Mark_Kindy, Apr 20, 2012.

  1. Mark_Kindy

    Mark_Kindy Mezzo Forte User

    Jul 11, 2010
    Gainesville, FL
    That was my view on the subject as well, I really didn't think it was a problem. I'm glad to know it's not a big deal, it was being made out like my lips weren't strong enough....which I would say is hardly the case. It would also ONLY happen during tonguing, not during a held note
  2. Bob Grier

    Bob Grier Forte User

    May 4, 2007
    Greensboro, NC
    Yea, yea, all the rest of us are dummies. Let's all bow down to the god of trumpet.

    To improve tonguing in the extreme registers, practice tonguing in the extreme registers. be aware that as you change registers that the tonguing has to adjust to the change in the air column. We spend most of our time in the middle registers. if you are not having any problems there you have a good basis to expand from. When approaching the extreme registers start slow. Give you tongue and air a chance to learn to work together smoothly.

    When we play in the low register there is less compression of the air column. This means that the air is less dense so it requires a very light tongue to play cleanly. Excessive tongue movement will easily disrupt the sound. In the upper register the air is more closely packed together because of compression of the air column.. It's More dense. This means it can take a little more time to learn to tongue cleanly. go slow at first.

    At all times use only the tip of the tongue. Use the least amount of tongue movement you can and keep the tongue relaxed.. I like to use the syllable ta because it keeps the back of the tongue relaxed. Always think of blowing through the tongue. The air supports the tongue allowing it to relax and move quickly.

    There are a number of good exercises for this. The Clarke Technicial Studies 1 and 2 work real well for this. do them tongued. You can extend the upper range of the 2nd study as high as you need to.
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2012
  3. Local 357

    Local 357 Banned

    Jul 1, 2011

    Here we see an easily disproved false notion of physics (although i agree with him on the Clarke Studies)

    Take the statement:

    In the upper register the air is more closely packed together because of compression of the air column.. It's More dense. This means it can take a little more time to learn to tongue cleanly.

    Sounds reasonable doesn't it? There's just one tiny, little, nagging problem. Its all bunk. lol

    Oh and before we explain the obvious irrationality of the remark EXPECT him to dispute my correction. If I said "water seeks its own level"? He'd dispute this merely because i said it. Grier resents it when I take trumpet "experts" to task for 19th century analysis. Even when it is so obvious. Now I'm not going to accuse Grier of taking a 19th century approach. No need to bring negativity to the forum. The rest of us just might however take note of his defense of these antiquated ideas. THEN draw their own conclusions

    the air pressure of the tongue ALWAYS ='s the air pressure inside the mouth. While of course the PSI inside the mouth changes from near barometric pressure to approximately 8PSI for the loudest and highest of notes the tongue will INSTANTANEOUSLY reach the same pressure as the rest of the mouth cavity.

    So if the tongue AND the mouth are at the same pressure there is absolutely no additional stress put upon the tongue. A coin six miles down at the bottom of the Mariana Trench is still a coin. Objects remain unchanged when at different pressures. Only where the air pressure is different (where the embouchure opens to the mouthpiece) is there a significant change

    Thus the matter of differing air pressure inside the mouth is a VOID concept.

    Hey Grier guess what?

  4. Phil986

    Phil986 Forte User

    Nov 16, 2009
    Near Portland, OR.
    Local your insecurity is making your posts less and less interesting every time. It's like trying to watch a movie on cable. So sliced up with advertisement for yourself that one is bound to loose interest. At least you've replaced some of your all caps with bold font, that's a form of progress.

    I read Bob's post over and over again trying to find the stuff you claim to be "19th century", all I see is this: "This means it can take a little more time to learn to tongue cleanly. go slow at first."

    It does not say anything whatsoever about the tongue being itself affected by pressure, or being at a different pressure or anything of that nature. It just says that it can take more time to tongue cleanly when pressure in the air column is higher. Exactly how that would relate to the high pressure as cause and effect is in fact not touched in Bob's rather short statement. But, being who you are, you have to jump on this and turn it into some ridiculous ego battle, of which you proclaim yourself the winner, even though it did not even really happen. You make up a straw man, knock it down with great fanfare, then go parading around congratulating yourself. And finish with a statement that I've seen exclusively used by teenagers so far ("owned"). For someone who claims to have life experience (which you have done on several occasions), that's surprising. If I was into that kind of teenage talk, I'd be tempted to go something like "grow up, dude."

    I used to think you had something to say because you can play high and loud. Silly me. I can not recall any of the artists in residence here, nor any of the mods, getting anywhere near that kind of childish attitude, perhaps because they actually go about their art without feeling every second that they have something to prove. The only one I've ever seen here with an attitude comparable to yours was Kurt (Yourbrassinstructor).

    You may very well have something to say. Too bad it gets lost in all the obnoxious noise.

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