Intonation

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by J. Jericho, Sep 12, 2014.

  1. stumac

    stumac Fortissimo User

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    For an in depth discussion of the differences between Natural harmonic series, Just intonation and Equal temperament.

    Horn-u-copia-Library- Bookshelf-Boosey compensation system, Appendix page 21 on.

    Regards, Stuart.
     
  2. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't understand what you want/mean. I have been on board with Dave since 1997 (AjnaII and Prana3 plus mouthpieces for all my horns except the natural trumpet). I visit the artists just about every time they are in Germany. Most of the stories I have heard firsthand.

    None of the Monette artists attribute their "success" to the instrument or Dave Monette. They don't buy the horns to sound "dark" or "brilliant". They jump on Monettes bandwagon because the instruments offer a big palette of colors, a great amount of security and peace of mind. All of that simply lowers the amount of emotional and physical tension allowing more of the PERSON to leak out.

    I can't blindfolded necessarily hear when a Monette is being played, but I sure can hear when a player is not being held back by themselves. The only thing more fun than experiencing that is to play with those people and never stop grinning for the whole gig!

    The moral of the story is that I am one of those lucky ones that have found "unity" with myself and the gigs that I am booked for as well as the equipment that lets me fulfill my wildest dreams. After meeting Dave Monette, even my playing on my Bach 229CL, natural trumpet and cornetto got better.
     
  3. Tjnaples

    Tjnaples Piano User

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    Can I play lip bends and be out of tune? Absolutely. All I've been trying to communicate is Monette trumpets don't naturally go out of tune like other trumpets playing loud or soft requiring us to compensate. Dave communicates this point better than myself which is why I was glad to find it. Can someone play out of tune on a Monette? Sure, lift the head, have a leaky tuning slide, lip bends. But when played with proper technique the horn gets out of your way with less to worry about and compensate for.

    Same team, same team! :-)
     
  4. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    roflrolroflrofl
     
  5. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Actually I know as many people that have serious intonation issues with Monette horns/mouthpieces as those that don't. None of them are second cut players either. Monettes pitch center is just one of the parameters that CAN lead to a different type of playing. I would not call it panacea however. It works for me because I use many different instruments depending on the orchestra or ensemble. The Monette comes out where it fits sonically. Never for Mozart, Mahler or Bruckner, always for Mussorgsky, Britten and Stravinsky.

    The Monette artists do not have the market cornered on intonation, tone or musicality. They simply offer a different choice.

    Don't get me wrong, I love my horns, they do not define my playing. That is 100% me.

     
  6. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

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    I don't get enough compensation to be able to afford a Monette.

    The Monettes I have played for free (at Trumpet Hangs) are good horns. They are not magical, and intonation issues still exist with these horns. I find my Martin and Olds play with the same personal intonation characteristics as the Monette (even my Ambassador) when I test drive them at Trumpet Hangs.
     
  7. Tjnaples

    Tjnaples Piano User

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    I suggest learning the Alexander Technique, it is quite amazing in solving these issues on any horn. Rowuk, not sure what to say here, except we agree to agree and disagree lol.
     
  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Gary: We are creatures of habit. Playing any axe at any "hang" cannot let us really get into what it is about unless it is similar to what we already use. I think most of the Monette story needs to be taught by using the mouthpieces for a year or so - and then adding the instrument.

    TJ: As far as agreeing to agree to disagree, I still don't know what you mean. I know the Ajna II Bb and Prana3 Bb intimately through many years of firsthand experience. I have over 100 paid gigs a years from renaissance to modern big band jazz that get played on a variety of instruments (including Monette), so there aren't many cracks or crevices left unexplored. I compensate intonation on every single horn. With the Bach C, I use alternate fingerings which is legit when the product out of the bell works. I don't think about compensation, or even teach it as a something that we have to "think" about. If any of my horns was so far out that I could not manage, it wouldn't last 2 minutes.

    I really love my Monette, but not because of "tone" or "intonation". I use it because of the big palette of colors and low amount of energy required to make it work.
     
  9. stumac

    stumac Fortissimo User

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    On page 6 of my Arban's 1907 edition there are instructions for adjusting the valve slides to tune the instrument to itself. I realize this is from the time intonation aids were not invented. Is this still applicable to modern horns?

    I only have 1 horn which fulfills this criteria a 1923 Couturier conical bore (Oldlou's) does not have adjustable slides in the valve loops.

    Comments please.

    Regards, Stuart.
     

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