Is it impossible for some people to develop good tone?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Trumpeter3197, Aug 8, 2013.

  1. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon
    Doc says, "Longs tones is (are) only the beginning ..."


    Yeah .... Good point, Doc. That's so true. You've got the credentials and that's why they gave you the white coat. :thumbsup:


    Turtle
     
  2. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon

    Actually, he does sound like himself ..... The Stan Getz was only a subjective idea on my part. He also sounds, sometimes, like Dexter Gordon (especially on Soprano), and occasionally like Coltrane. Again, all subjective assessments from me.

    So, to disagree ...He's got his own sound and his own vibe ... no failure at all. I would like to sound like any one of those guys, for just a moment.

    And anyway, why on earth would I want to sound like Turtle (after 8 months of playing)??? Are you kidding??? I sound like ... well, not bad but nevermind. THE WAY we achieve tone .... by copying others. LATER, I'll develop my own personal tone/style. But for now, copy copy copy!!!


    Turtle
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2013
  3. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

    18,125
    9,298
    Jan 28, 2011
    Dayton, Ohio
    Turtle... they gave me the white coat because I passed all the course work and clinical rotation required by the AAMC. I was given the trumpet chair in Eddie's ensemble because I play with passion and empathy. That is more of an accomplishment then putting on any white coat.

    Wish many of the physicians I work with could practice with the goal of passion and empathy in mind. Many of my colleagues have rather accepted mediocrity by just wearing a white coat.
     
  4. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

    8,040
    2,035
    Aug 16, 2009
    Jackson NC
    Aha! To dialect abbreviate "thinkin" you need to add the apostrophe vis, thinkin'. Now apply that to Dayton as phonetically sounding the same as "Datin'" you'll understand BigDub's jibe.
     
  5. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    60
    12,459
    7,035
    Mar 23, 2006
    Parts Unknown
    Doc has different credentials, and while he got the white coat, I got gray sweats and my shoelaces taken away, but, even crazy people know that long tones played with a crappy sound only serve to reinforce a crappy sound. One instant of satori, awareness when a good sound unbidden comes out trumps the guys in the white coats any day.
     
  6. RicardoStalwart

    RicardoStalwart Pianissimo User

    73
    12
    Aug 20, 2012
    Maryland
    Hmm I somewhat agree; but essentially I think all instrumentalists are hybrids of all their influences on that instrument as well as others. For example you may like miles davis's tone but also like Clifford browns note accenting ; I don't know maybe your concept is to phrase like a violinist or a pianist.

    Your going to end up developing your own sound/ concept. It doesn't hurt to try to copy someone you likes tone; that's a pretty good idea to adopt a tone just dont try copying their soul because it wont work. Freddie Hubbard admitting to copying miles's stuff and one day miles showed up at one of his shows and said something like " its nice to hear you playing your own ideas".

    Other trumpet players our templates (temporary/fragmented) that serve as a model until you develop into your own. However, alot dont get to the develop unto your own part and just sound like drones its quite said. There's guys who can play clifford/lee morgan/miles lines very well but are no fun to listen to in 2013
     
  7. RicardoStalwart

    RicardoStalwart Pianissimo User

    73
    12
    Aug 20, 2012
    Maryland
    My jazz teacher told me to go home and do long tones when my tone was suffering and I did.........my tone improved greatly. When you do long tones your supposed to make it sound as pretty as possible. So If your Ab below the staff sucks like mine did and you understand that the air needs to be warm and slow, as well as the right amount of air; you get better at playing an Ab below the staff because your muscles will remember. I don't think long tones alone are the key but I definitely agree with Doc that ..."its the start!"
     
  8. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon
    There's nothing wrong with copying someone else's tone .... This happens naturally with almost all students who take private lessons, especially in the beginning. The luckier students have teachers with nice tones. It's not like humans are born with a tonal concept .... you have to do some listening to discover what a nice tone is. There's plenty of time down the road to let your ear and your taste in music steer you to your own tone and your own playing style.

    Avoiding long tones, or suggesting that long tones are useless or just a reinforcement of so-called "bad" tone is just another way of avoiding something that's good for you and rationalizing it away. It's a lot like Broccoli that way, or Brussels Sprouts. I'm sensing a serious anti-long tone undertone here.


    Turtle
     
  9. BigDub

    BigDub Fortissimo User

    4,808
    2,997
    Dec 19, 2009
    Hillsborough, NJ
    It's almost an overtone, but definitely this is getting long.
     
  10. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon
    A sub-tone of the long-tone discussion on tonality would be the caveat that, if you are going to try and copy the tone of someone famous (from recordings, probably), it helps to meet half-way with at least some similarity of gear. Good luck to anyone trying to sound like Doc Severinsen, while playing a Martin Committee, with a darkish mp. Sometimes the answer to a better tone is better gear. If you are playing a beat up student Bundy, try getting a decent horn, and see what that does to your tone.

    That ought to stir up some embers. :evil:

    Yes, I know it's the player and not the horn, but really ... c'mon. You can't get a duck to sound like an elephant, no matter how much training you give it.


    Turtle
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2013

Share This Page