Is this the same concept as the Pilczuk leadpipe?

Discussion in 'Horns' started by trickg, Sep 13, 2005.

  1. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    Ever since picking up a Schilke B6 Bb trumpet back in March or April, I have really enjoyed playing it and I have been reading (Thanks to Jim Donaldson and the Schilke Loyalist website) some of the writings of Renold Schilke regarding his Bb trumpet designs and the great steps he took in trying to make them as perfect as possible - something that I feel every time I play mine.

    Anyway, I was perusing an article about nodal patterns in brass instruments that he wrote, and this paragraph (quoted from the Schilke Loyalist site) jumped out at me:
    The part that I highlighted in italics and bold sounds very much like what Gene Pilczuk did with his leadpipe, only it sounds as if it is all done on the inside of the leadpipe.

    Does anyone know if this is close to the same thing, and if it is, is it something that they continue to do now?

    It is facinating to me that Renold Schilke went to the lengths that he did while designing, prototyping and testing his trumpets before he would sign off on them and offer them up to the public. I've heard that if you are lucky enough to find one in good shape, the 60s era Schilkes are absolutely amazing trumpets, and if a good deal presents itself, it should be jumped on without hesitation.
     
  2. gzent

    gzent Fortissimo User

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    Similar maybe, but not the same. On Pilczuk pipes you can feel and see the steps on the leadpipe. Also, Pilczuk pipes are patented.

    Greg
     
  3. brian moon

    brian moon Forte User

    Gene's idea is that you have chambers that are each the length of a particular note. Keep dividing 4 feet (C) in half (higher octaves)and you will eventually get to 3/16" which is approx. the length of the chamber for C in his pipe. I just eyeballed one, I don't think that it is 3/32", it's hard to see in there. Gene's patent is about different length cylindrical chambers. It is related to a patent on a cornet from 1917 that had a telescopic leadpipe. The player could adjust the chambers according to their own preferences on that one.

    Schilke's idea is a different concept. His is about changing tapers at nodal points.

    At one time Gene did have his lawyer send one company a letter telling them to stop infringing his patent. He told me that the un-named company complied with his request.

    I think that I would love to jump on a Schilke trumpet but if I owned one I would probably take the smart way out and sell it instead. :-) O.K I 'm leaving now.
     
  4. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    I meant that we should jump on the deal, not the trumpet itself. ;-)

    Gzent - I know what you mean - the different cylindrical chambers of the Pilczuk leadpipe are visible both inside and outside of the horn. What I find is interesting is that even if Schilke Leadpipes are curved and smooth, at least some effort was put into making the proper tapers in the right places to maximize intonation and slotting. I wonder if a leadpipe could be made that was chambered cylindrically on the inside, but smooth and tapered on the outside?

    On the subject of Pilczuk pipes, while most agree that they are very good, I have also heard some that do not like them because they slot too well and too tightly, and some people like a looser feel for their horns. However, that doesn't stop me from wanting to get one as part of a Frankenhorn project.

    On the subject of my Schilke, intonation is very consistent throughout on this trumpet, possibly due to the overall design, possibly due to the leadpipe itself, but the slotting is pretty tight too. I'll have to take a peep inside the leadpipe when I get it back from Bob Reeves to see if I can see what was described in the paragraph that I posted above.
     
  5. gzent

    gzent Fortissimo User

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    I haven't noticed 'tight' slotting on my horn with the Pilczuk, but of course I designed it to have minimal bracing and a wide open blow.

    Greg
     
  6. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    Well, as a side note, the last time I saw Maynard, Patrick Hession didn't seem to sound like he was having any problems with the Pilczuk fitted Yamaha "Z" he was playing at the time either. :lol:
     
  7. brian moon

    brian moon Forte User

    The valves on Patrick's Z leaked like a sieve. It would be very difficult to have a leadpipe that could make up for that.
     
  8. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    No kidding? He was screaming and just nailing it the night I went to hear them. I asked him about his leadpipe that night and his response was fairly simple; to him, the Pilczuk leadpipe was good fit for the horn.
     
  9. Oldgreentoad

    Oldgreentoad New Friend

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    Patrick,

    Would you be so kind as to post your impressions of the PVA when you get it back for Reeves. I am very interested it what you think the before and after differences are.
    Thanks,
    Jason
     
  10. brian moon

    brian moon Forte User

    What I meant to say was that the valves leaked so much that any over slotting by the leadpipe wouldn't happen on his horn. That leadpipe (R27X) is a good match for the Z and I don't think that any Z would be made too stiff by it. Ken Robinson and Walter White use the same one on their Zs.
     

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