Large bore vs. small bore question

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by ArtM, Nov 18, 2009.

  1. flugelgirl

    flugelgirl Forte User

    Jan 20, 2008
    Seattle, WA
    I've never quite understood that philosophy -if four jazzers each playing a different brand of horn can make a great section, than why won't that work for orchestral players? I believe it has a lot more to do with training and sound concept than the equipment. Equipment can make a difference, of course, but give me a 1c and a large bore Bach and I'm still gonna sound like myself - just a very tired version of myself!
  2. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    I believe it is more brand blindness than sound concept. If I listen to the old symphony recordings with Ghitalla in Boston, there was no sound issue, really old NY recordings also sound fine. Most of the german orchestras also "tolerate" mixed brands.

    I am pretty sure that marketing tools "secure" these myths about blend. Yamaha does invest in their artists and I am sure that there are "most favored customers" at Bach too!
  3. Al Innella

    Al Innella Forte User

    Aug 9, 2007
    Levittown , NY
    Why do people assume that every student is going to or for that matter even wants to play with a major symphony orchestra ?
  4. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    Nobody does. The point is only that a Benge, as fine a horn as it is/was, is not a universal solution.
  5. RUFocused

    RUFocused Pianissimo User

    Apr 26, 2009
    Cedar Rapids, IA
    To this, Rowuk is right.
  6. Markie

    Markie Forte User

    Jan 4, 2009
    Clarksburg, WV
    "Nobody does. The point is only that a Benge, as fine a horn as it is/was, is not a universal solution"
    I don't know about universal solutions but the one thing the poster is sure of, he likes the horn and the horn likes him. I say we give them our Blessing.

    Speaking of solutions, Is Lambic beer a universal solution?
  7. Darthsunshine

    Darthsunshine Mezzo Forte User

    Jul 19, 2008
    Seattle, WA
    Fortunately, at the minor league amateur level we're allowed to do as we please. Three ML Benges in our trumpet section :thumbsup:
  8. ComeBackKid

    ComeBackKid Fortissimo User

    May 11, 2009
    Yorba Linda, CA
    All anyone needs to do to convince themselves of this is to do the following:
    a. Remove the mouthpiece, take a deep breath, blow hard into the trumpet and time how long it takes to exhaust the lungs (4-8 seconds?).
    b. Insert the mouthpiece and repeat (with the lips on the outside of the mouthpiece). How long does it take to exhaust the lungs again? (maybe 6-10 seconds?)

    Obviously the throat of the mouthpiece is waaay smaller than the smallest bore trumpet ever made yet it hardly changes the rate of airflow through the trumpet. So, the actual bore of the instrument can hardly have any effect at all.

    Now, take a deep breath and blow a steady note such as G. Depending on your lung capacity, you may be able to blow 30 sec to maybe 2 minutes. So, the time to blow notes is 5-10 times as long as it takes to move air through the pipes. What is the difference? - The aperature of the lips and the impedance mismatch that occurs at the bell end. It is not the size the plumbing that does it.

    It is possible to put a trumpet mouthpiece into a trombone (I have done it) and play the same range and duration of notes as a trumpet. The larger bore and bell of the trombone only changes the overtones and timbre of the sound. (I haven't tried this with a Tuba or Sousaphone but I suspect the outcome would be similar).

    So, forget bore. Think music.

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