Learning how to double tongue

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by mummytuf, Nov 20, 2011.

  1. tpsiebs

    tpsiebs Piano User

    Feb 6, 2010
    Randolph, New Jersey
    Just to be contrary, I think that there is no point to learning how to double tongue until the student has "hit the wall" tempo-wise with his single tongue. I was taught double tonguing WAY too early and developed a lazy, slow tongue. The underlying reason that my single tongue was slow was because it was flawed: I was anchor tonguing and didn't realize it until I was a sophomore music major in college. My nick name should have been "Chip". Because the single tonguing was poor, the double tonguing was simply fast and poor. Nothing got straightened out until I corrected my fundamental single tonguing technique as which point EVERYTHING fell into place from an articulation standpoint.
  2. ccNochops

    ccNochops Piano User

    Sep 30, 2006
    White Marsh, VA
    Arban's and practice. When it came to me, it was just there, but if the finger response is lacking it won't work.....weird....chuck
  3. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    Not to be argumentative, but that is some pretty weak advice.

    First a lazy tongue is not caused by multiple tonguing, rather by bad practice habits, bad monitoring from the teachers,........
    Second, the earlier that we tackle something, generally the easier it is. When we have a decent sound, starting multiple tonguing requires completely new habits, not only for articulation but also for range. The later that we start, the more intrusion it has on our playing schedule.
    Anchor tonguing does not have to be bad. It does show that a teacher was sleeping however.
  4. coolerdave

    coolerdave Utimate User

    Nov 7, 2009
    San Pedro
    I am right there with Rowuk ... and mostly everyone else here.
    You really need to start slow and be precise as possible. A metronome is really not optional. The Arbans has solid exercises. The thing I work on in my exercises to to keep the air support flowing and not just "spit" out the Ku syllable. I try to get a nice even attack on both syllables as well. I exagerate the attacks at first and play them very slow. If I remember correctly, Claude Gordon said to raise your fingers up and press down forcefully. I found that helps keep me play the notes even. Eventually you will be able to back off of the exergerated fingers and tonguing.. it's easier to back off later then try to try go the other way.
    I use the Clarke Technical Studies as well.
    Expect to get frustrated ... that means you are trying. If you find yourself getting tongue tied, click the metronome back a notch or two until you can make it through the whole exercise and then keep it there for an entire week.
  5. GMike45

    GMike45 New Friend

    Oct 23, 2011
    Hey Mummytuf, great question! Now these are all my opinions, so try them out, if it doesn't work, try something else! It's all about what works for you, no one else.

    First, don't use Ta or Ka. Both spread the lips across the face, instead of pointing towards the mouthpiece. I recommend using Tu Ku Tu. Tu and Ku naturally point your lips forward without you even having to think about it.

    Next, don't be discouraged about how long it takes to develop. Go to page 155 in the Arban book and start with triple tonging.

    Remember, no rush.

    Also to clarify everything, you are your own person with your own brain, so you need to find what works for you. That's what will work best.

    Happy practicing!
  6. mrsemman

    mrsemman Piano User

    Apr 8, 2010
    I too, am trying to learn double tounguing. I have a daily exercise to assist. I play a couple of bars of g in eighth notes. It can be any note, as the key is to embed the "ta ka" into your mind. I first use single tonguing with a "ta" sound, then again with a "da" sound; and then finally with a "ka" sound. After playing the "ka" sound for a while, I try to bring it forward in my mouth to a point as close to the front as possible. Then, all I have to do is to introduce the "tah" sound before the "kah" sound. Start slow and gradually build up speed.
  7. operagost

    operagost Forte User

    Jan 25, 2009
    Spring City, PA, USA
    Why would anyone think anchor tonguing is bad? Ghitalla used it, and Gordon's "K-tongue modified" is essentially the same. Lee Loughnane learned it at 50. Maybe it's not for everyone, but it works for many.
  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    That is a question like is Bach the best brand to buy. I think that anchor tonguing is more the exception than the rule. I also think that one Bach should be in every trumpeters stable.

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