Lost nearly an octave of range

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Hornlife98, Dec 26, 2014.

  1. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Start with 2nd line G and play softly. Try and make the tone even.
     
  2. ozboy

    ozboy Mezzo Forte User

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    Get on the net and look up mystery to mastery greg spence from Melbourne. Have a look through his videos as he addresses some of the issues you may be having and gives you exercises to do to help. Part of the problem that many young players have is the notion that buzzing is the focus. I have learnt that you do not buzz. you make the horn resonate. Greg demonstrates this.
     
  3. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    SMH! Your lips must buzz to create the standing wave. You can call it what you will, buzz, vibration, oscillation, blowing into the horn with air alone doesn't create a standing wave. Kingtrumpet expounded a few years ago with his air compressor demo that air alone doe nothing but go through the horn. Another infrequent poster proclaimed we no longer have to buzz a few years ago. They too used Grey's excellent videos as "proof" of this. Geez, this is basic how does a trumpet work 101. If your lips don't vibrate/buzz from the air you blow through your lips, you won't create the standing wave.
     
  4. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    Arbans 1st Study number nine, with each note a long tone, pppp. Don't chip notes.
     
  5. ozboy

    ozboy Mezzo Forte User

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    I really think you should spend some time with Greg Spence. He makes a lot of sense.
     
  6. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

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    Actually much as Greg Spence does make a lot of sense the notion that many people seem to take from him that the lip doesn't buzz as some sort of revolutionary thinking in brass playing isn't helpful. I have come across the sort of thing you are parroting before ozboy. The lips do buzz but it what activates the buzz that Spence perhaps isn't as clear. He asserts that the standing wave of air when focused by the lead pipe set the standing wave in motion then the lip vibrates almost sympathetically with the leadpipe. He does not however say there is no buzz. This has been the subject of a lot of threads on here both discussing and in some cases arguing about this sort of thing. Hope this helps.
     
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  7. ozboy

    ozboy Mezzo Forte User

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    Not really parroting anything Cornyandy. Parroting. What is that anyway? Greg's point is that many people get confused by the role of the embouchure and get obsessed. Obviously the lips buzz. It is not a kazoo. It is how you mentally approach the job of the embouchure that can affect the efficiency of its job. I have dealt with students who have been preoccupied with buzzing idea, often by putting it in a different manner, ie resonating, it stops them from over focussing and relaxing which allows the natural process to take place.. In my opinion the backswing and slingshot practical exercises could reallyhelp this young fella.
     
  8. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

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    Ozboy, You have just gone back on yourself "I have learnt that you do not buzz" now "obviously the lips buzz" You cannot have it both ways. In my mind parroting is repeated advice it's just a short hand. I have always been impressed by Greg Spence and is ideas but we have had a number of people on here use him as ammunition in a "you don't need to buzz" discussion without actually understanding (or really listening to) what he is saying.
     
  9. ozboy

    ozboy Mezzo Forte User

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    You have totally missed the point. Look in the scale exercise and at how his embouchure is overworking. 'Over technicalizing' the information to a young player can be very detrimental. I suggest Cornyandy that you search for a book called the Inner Game of Tennis. Too much information is not always a good thing. Simplifying can often lead to a more relaxed, natural production. I stand by my statement that simplifying the terminology and giving practical exercises that take the emphasis from the texhnical role of the embouchure for this young fella will probably be of more help than muddying the waters with standing wave information.
     
  10. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

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    I agree with you that simplification is great and a fantastic way to relax and play naturally. I would suggest that the young man has issues with his breathing and yes some with his embouchure being far too "active."

    What I don't like is that first statement "I have learnt that you do not buzz" I believe that to be confusing in itself. I would hate to have a series of young trumpeters trying not to buzz and getting no more than a air noise through the horn. It is for me an oversimplification, a step too far if you will. It is not that the lips don't buzz it is what sets them vibrating that is the issue. I believe the young man in question has enough issues without being told "you do not buzz" That for me is not simplification it is adding confusion through gross oversimplification. Please note that this is not a criticism of Greg Spence but a concern about those that take his videos to mean "You do not buzz"

    I personally don't like the slingshot as I believe it can (note "can") lead to tension at the transition between inhale and exhale but again to each their own. Circle of Breath or a similar technique (I seem to remember someone describing a very similar thing to me years ago as clock breathing) whatever this lad needs to breath deeper longer and stronger. Hopefully this will help but as Rouwk often notes it has to be the whole package and not a piecemeal bit of advice that will in time fix issues. (Obviously you are touchy so I will add that I am not just calling your advice piecemeal but snippets from others as well)
     

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