Mistake: Vaseline on slides

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Cpt.Funk, Oct 28, 2012.

  1. Cpt.Funk

    Cpt.Funk New Friend

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    Hey TM... unfortunate mistake; I've been using vaseline on my slides for about a month. I just recently read that this product should never be used because it can cause red rot. My question is this: could damage have been caused in this short period of time, or would a wash and immediate switch to a proper lubricant rectify any future issues?

    Thanks!
     
  2. Recursion

    Recursion Mezzo Piano User

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    Wash it off immediately, then dry it well. Wash again if needed. Apply slide grease, and you should be fine.
     
  3. TrumpetMD

    TrumpetMD Fortissimo User

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    I've heard this claim, but I don't believe it. Or I don't understand why it would be true.

    My understanding is that petroleum jelly (Vasoline) is a mixture of non-polar mineral hydrocarbons. This is not unlike valve oil, which is also a mixture of non-polar mineral hydrocarbons. How can this cause red rot (which I believe requires acids to leach the zinc out of brass)?

    Any chemists out there who can clarify things?

    Mike
     
  4. gchun

    gchun Piano User

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    I've used vaseline on slides that need to move fast (1st & 3rd) for over 30 years without issue.

    Flip Oakes has a tip about mixing lanolin with vaseline for slide grease:

    Flip Oakes Hints & Tips

    Garry
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2012
  5. amzi

    amzi Forte User

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    I've been using Vaseline on my slides for 50+ years. I currently have owned my Recording Olds for more than 45 years and my Bach MLV for more than 40 years and never used anything but Vaseline on the slides. No trace of red rot or corrosion, but I do have slides that function cleanly and smoothly. As far as I'm concerned the tales of Vaseline harming your horns were started by people who want to charge you high prices for small quantities of their branded product.
     
  6. Peter McNeill

    Peter McNeill Utimate User

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    Vaseline causes Red Rot - I Think NOT.

    I used Vaseline for years as well on the slides. That was all that was used back in the 70s. I used Mum's Pond's Face Cream on the Trombone slides as well back then and was the best stuff. I still use Vaseline for slides for most horns,

    The only risk with Vaseline I believe, is that it may migrate to the valves and cause issues with sticking due to types of valve oil. This would be if you used too much, or was not cleaned off and accumulated enough to allow a glob to move from the slide to the valves. I never experienced this as I cleaned and wiped it off, and reapplied sparsely. I still use it sometimes, but only went to Ultra Pure Slide grease recently for the Heavy slide due to some tuning slides slipping out slowly.

    Vaseline and Lanolin would protect against corrosion IMO.
    If you use it sparingly - you will not have any problems.
     
  7. Recursion

    Recursion Mezzo Piano User

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    Mike,

    I read it can trap moisture, which sounds feasible. Maybe it's because it's thick, or maybe it's a trumpet urban legend? I've always used slide grease, so it's a non-issue for me. :-)
     
  8. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    Ingredients from vaselineskinfund.com:

    BORAGO OFFICINALIS SEED OIL
    An emollient; specifically, a botanical oil rich in triglycerides (which are building blocks of skin lipids) and antioxidants (which are a part of nature's defense and repair mechanisms).

    BUTYLENE GLYCOL
    A humectant material that binds with water molecues and holds them in skin cells.

    CAPRYLIC/CAPRIC TRIGLYCERIDE
    An emollient; helps seak in moisture and gives your skin a smooth feel.

    CARBOMER
    A thickener; gives lotion a thick, rich feel.

    CETYL ALCOHOL
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    CLYCERYL STEARATE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    CYCLOPENTASILOXANE
    A silicone; gives lotion a smooth, skily feel.

    DIMETHICONE
    An occlusive emollient material made from silicone, dimethicone helps seal in moisture and gives your skin a smooth feel.

    DISODIUM EDTA
    A preservative; essential to keep lotion fresh every time you want to use it.

    DISTEARLYDIMONIUM CHLORIDE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product This particular emulsifier iteracts with the skin surface to provide a silky skin feel.

    DMDM HYDANTOIN
    A preservative; essential to keep lotion fresh every time you want to use it.

    ETHYLENE BRASSYLATE
    An odor neutralizer to help mask any unpleasant odors from certain essential ingredients. Because Intensive Rescue products are unfragranced, they do not hide their ingredients behind a wall of heavy perfume.

    GLYCERIN
    A humectant or "water magnet" that binds with water molecules and holds them in skin cells. Glycerin effectively replicates the role of your skin's own natural moisturizing factor.

    GLYCERYL STEARATE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    GLYCINE SOJA (SOYBEAN) STEROL
    An emollient; specifically, a botanical oil rich in triglycerides (which are building blocks of skin lipids) and antioxidants (which are a part of nature's defense and repair mechanisms).

    GLYCOL STEARATE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    HELIANTHUS ANNUUS (SUNFLOWER) SEED OIL
    An emollient; specifically, a botanical oil rich in triglycerides (which are building blocks of skin lipids) and antioxidants (which are a part of nature's defense and repair mechanisms).

    HYDROXYETHYLCELLULOSE
    A thickener; gives lotion a thick, rich feel.

    ISOPROPYL ISOSTEARATE
    An emollient and humectant; helps seak in moisture and gives your skin a smooth feel.

    ISOPROPYL PALMITATE
    An emollient; helps seal in moisture and gives your skin a smooth feel.

    LACTIC ACID
    An Alpha Hydroxy Acid that helps soften hard calloused skin.

    LECITHIN
    A natural phospholipid known to be an important component of healthy cell membranes.

    LINOLEIC ACID
    An essential fatty acid known to be a building block for skin ceramides (which are components of a healthy lipid barrier).

    LINOLENIC ACID
    An essential fatty acid that is a building block for skin ceramides (which are components of a healthy lipid barrier).

    MAGNESIUM ALUMINUM SILICATE
    A structurant (or a thickener) to give the lotion a rich, elegant consistency. Structurants add thickness to the formula without adding heaviness or stickiness to the lotion.

    METHYLPARABEN
    A preservative; essential to keep lotion fresh every time you want to use it.

    MINERAL OIL
    An emollient; helps seak in moisture and gives your skin a smooth feel.

    PEG-100 STEARATE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    PETROLATUM
    Pure Vaseline Petroleum Jelly has been caring for skin over 130 years. It is an occlusive emollient that seals water within your skin and its cells. Petrolatum fills in for lost lipids to help restore skin's all-important barrier function - keeping the outside world out, and the moisture in.

    PHENOXYETHANOL
    A preservative; essential to keep lotion fresh every time you want to use it.

    POTASSIUM HYDROXIDE
    A neutralizing agent used to maintain the pH of lotions.

    POTASSIUM LACTATE
    Used to maintain the pH of the AHA at an effective level.

    PROPYLPARABEN
    A preservative; essential to keep lotion fresh every time you want to use it.

    SODIUM CHLORIDE
    Works with cationic emulsifer.

    SODIUM HYDROXYPROPYL STARCH PHOSPHATE
    A thickener; gives lotion a thick, rich feel.

    STEARETH-21
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    STEARIC ACID
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    STEARYL STEARATE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    TAPIOCA STARCH
    A thickener; this particular thickener gives lotion a smooth, silky feel.

    TITANIUM DIOXIDE
    An opacifier that helps bring out the clean white color of the lotion.

    TOCOPHERYL ACETATE (VITAMIN E ACETATE)
    A material naturally found in skin as a natural anti-oxidant.

    TRIETHANOLAMINE
    An emulsifier; an ingredient that helps to hold the lotion together. These ingredients are what keep all the other ingredients blended together in a smooth, creamy product.

    WATER
    Water is fundamentally essential to quickly restore the flexibility of your skin's dry surface layers, but it requires additional ingredients to keep it locked in.

    XANTHAN GUM
    A thickener; gives lotion a thick, rich feel.

    Red Rot is the result of the acid in our spit and breath. Drinking sodas while playing really promotes this, which is why trumpeters, for the most part, drink beer.
     
  9. amzi

    amzi Forte User

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    Northern California
    I don't know what you're using, but the ingredients on my current jar of Vaseline reads: White Petroleum USP (100%). The Vaseline VB is describing sounds like hand and/or body lotion. And perhaps that's where the problem lies. There is a difference between Vaseline (the original Pure Petroleum Jelly) that is suitable for slide use and other Vaseline brand products.
     
  10. Peter McNeill

    Peter McNeill Utimate User

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    Jan 30, 2009
    Melbourne Australia
    Yes,
    I assumed the Vaseline used here, is the Petroleum Jelly type. That's all I would use.

    And as VB says:
    "Red Rot is the result of the acid in our spit and breath. Drinking sodas while playing really promotes this, which is why trumpeters, for the most part, drink beer. "

    I fully agree, but do not need another excuse to drink more VB. It's back to the original taste too!!
    VB Original Ale – Hoppsy – the beer blog

    Matter of Fact, I got it Now!
    Original VB "matter a fact i got it now" Ad Victoria Bitter - YouTube
     

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