Monel vs Stainless Steel

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by kctrumpeteer, Feb 16, 2011.

  1. SteveRicks

    SteveRicks Fortissimo User

    Aug 15, 2009
    Kujo 20 -Yes agreed. To be honest, I probably am not the best at oiling my valves -typically oil when needed -definitely not every day. Still -check 4 posts up -horns holding up well. Over the years have used everything from Al Case to Karosene to lamp oil mix, to (now) synthetic and Blue Juice. No problems. I do a much better job now than in my youth. We were taught "oil when needed." I know a little better now.
  2. Trumpet Dreamer

    Trumpet Dreamer Mezzo Forte User

    Aug 14, 2010
    Jazz Town, USA
    I agree with the above. The stainless valves in my Carol Pocket are ULTRA SILKY SMOOTH. You have to play it to believe it. The overall feel is one step this side of insane!
  3. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

    Oct 26, 2003
    They'd have to be just fantastic to be better than the monel valves in my Schilke. Again, I've never been a person to have valve issues, but the valves on my Schilke are nothing short of spectacular.
  4. Trumpet Dreamer

    Trumpet Dreamer Mezzo Forte User

    Aug 14, 2010
    Jazz Town, USA
    Can't address the valves in your Schilke, but I can say this - Carol's stainless valves exceed the quality of those on my Getzen.
    The tactile feel is unreal. And yes, I (and others) would describe them as not being "just fantastic", but being super fantastic.

    For those who do not know, Carol Brass has been building valves for a number of other companies for years.

    No individuals or companies were harmed in the wording of this post.
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2011
  5. dsr0057

    dsr0057 Pianissimo User

    Dec 20, 2009
    Denton, TX
    It really comes down to longevity and preference in my opinion. The reason Taylor stainless steel valves feel great is the time and effort he puts into every horn so that they play to a certain quality. That's why you pay more for his horns. However if you buy a mid range popular horn like a Bach Strad 37 (a horn that was designed to be "good enough") then you are more likely to come into problems with the valves whether they are Monel, Nickel Plated or Stainless Steel. Quality is a huge factor!

    As for longevity gzent hit it on the nose: Stainless, nickel plated, monel. Getzen did a test a while back where they put a monel piston next to a nickel plated piston in a contraption that would simply move the piston up and down continuously. Not adding any lubricant the Monel piston lasted about 2,000 revolutions before the machine could not move it anymore. They turned the machine holding the nickel plated one off after 3 months.
  6. Trumpet Dreamer

    Trumpet Dreamer Mezzo Forte User

    Aug 14, 2010
    Jazz Town, USA
    You have brought up a point that I was eluding to earlier...that the overall quality of the horn is as important as the valve composition.

    Perhaps this is why Carol's valves (and trumpets) are so good.
  7. gzent

    gzent Fortissimo User

    Nov 5, 2003
    Rochester, MN
    My Harrelson Bravura has the Bauerfeind stainless steel valves with the bronze
    valve block. The quality is simply at another level than any other company's valves
    I've seen. Taylor and Eclipse use them also.

    Apparently Adams Musical Instruments bought Bauerfeind and uses that same valve block too. Maybe Trent Austin can comment on that....

    The thing with these isn't just how long will they last, but how well do they work.
    And the action and feel is superior to every other design I've touched.
  8. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

    Dec 22, 2008
    Here's a link to the actual test results.

    Getzen Gazette Manufacturing

    Monel got a bad rap, deservedly so, for bad valves in Yamaha and Schilke horns. Believe they were called Yamalloy. Had to do with the annealing process. It was/is fixable, but costly. Monel today is better than it was but still won't last as long as stainless or nickel plated valves. The monel actually lasted 128,000 strokes before failing.
  9. kcmt01

    kcmt01 Mezzo Forte User

    Sep 25, 2009
    Polson, MT
    The bronze valves in my Llewellyn are still tight.
  10. Alasdair

    Alasdair New Friend

    Dec 21, 2010
    Lowther Hills, Scotland
    This is a really interesting thread, I do wonder where silver plated valves fit into all this though?

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