Monette Adjustment Period

Discussion in 'Mouthpieces / Mutes / Other' started by eoliver, Dec 14, 2004.

Do you think $315 is too much for a mouthpiece?

  1. yes

    99.1%
  2. no

    0.9%
  1. eoliver

    eoliver Pianissimo User

    70
    0
    Nov 15, 2004
    Albuquerque, NM
    Hey Everybody,
    I've been trying out some of the Monette Prana lead mouthpieces, and had a few questions for those of you who have made the switch. I know that I should expect an adjustment period, but I was wondering how long that usually takes. The only other thing is it feels like some of the notes are in a different place. In particular, high g does not slot. On my old mouthpiece, it was a piece of cake. Up to high F is good, and above high g feels different, but better than the F# and G. Any advice? I'm starting winter break, so I have plenty of time to adjust before next semester. Thanks in advance.
     
  2. trumpetpimp

    trumpetpimp Piano User

    253
    0
    Dec 6, 2003
    Toronto
    I don't know a lot about Monette gear but I am a firm believer that to say X amount is too much to spend on a trumpet(or mouthpiece or whatever) is silly. If I had $30k to buy a set of Monette horns I definatly give them a try. On a more realistice scale I've tried some horns that were really nice but not $3000 nice, if you get my meaning. They were certianly better than my trumpet but not MORE nice enough to justify spending money on a new horn.

    If you find a mouthpiece that you think will let you play what you need to play and make it easier then I don't think you can say $315 is too much. Same thing for horns. $10k is a lot coin but keep in mind that it might be your dream horn and it might not be anything special but to say spending more than $2000 is too much is a pretty silly statement.
     
  3. MUSICandCHARACTER

    MUSICandCHARACTER Forte User

    1,140
    2
    Jan 31, 2004
    Newburgh, Indiana
    Boy, do I have a strong opinion about this. I know some professional players that love the Monette pieces.

    But here is my take:

    They are brass. Nice, but pieces of brass. Dave Monette is a genius in marketing. Make a $5 to $10K trumpet, make sure you have to wait several months for it, but pay for it in full.

    The mouthpieces have a NO RETURN policy. The most expensive pieces around, and no return. Here is the brilliant marketing part. He has an "acclimation" page for how to get used to your Monette piece. Brilliant, simply brilliant. Buy a $300+ mouthpiece that you cannot return, and if it doesn't work it is YOUR fault for not acclimating to it.

    Wow. No one else gets away with that. You buy any other mouthpiece and you can return it. If Mr. Monette was so confident that was the best mouthpiece ever, why not take returns? Who would return it if it is the best?

    I am happy to sell you this used trumpet I have in my store. A vintage trumpet. It is a Cleveland Toreador. It's selling price used (some lacquer wear) is $2000. NO RETURNS. This is a great trumpet. The best vintage trumpet ever. I have a common sense acclimation guide to help you adjust to your new vintage trumpet. Follow the guide and you will be playing like a pro very soon.

    Bah! (I actually have that horn for sale with a brand new case for $250).

    Like my dad said, Mr. Monette sells "blue sky" which has no limit. Brilliant marketing. Save some money and buy a Kanstul version if you really want to try one. Just look at all of them being sold on eBay.

    Monette is brilliant. He has the money (and the know how) to get Wynton and Maynard on board. He must make reasonable products. But save your money for CDs and buy a reasonable mouthpiece (or horn).

    Jim
     
  4. dizforprez

    dizforprez Forte User

    1,097
    1
    Nov 2, 2003
    Playing correctly is playing correctly, you don’t need a $300 + mouthpiece to play with “proper body alignmentâ€so I think the acclamation thing is bogus.

    Save your money, keep your old piece.
     
  5. eoliver

    eoliver Pianissimo User

    70
    0
    Nov 15, 2004
    Albuquerque, NM
    I have to say that I do agree with you all about the no return policy on Monettes, and through a stroke of luck I was able to get a couple of the Pranas at almost no cost to me. I'm not about to shell out $300 for a mouthpiece I can't try out. Luckily, I can try these out, and that's where the questions come in. Those who have had success with Monette equipment, how long did it take you to adjust? Did you experience the same things I am with notes being in different places? Is the change worth it, or is "conventional" equipment good enough?

    I do enjoy hearing about everyone's thoughts on cost compared to quality (or bluffing the buyer into thinking that they are buying something of real quality, if that's your take), and I hope to hear more about it.

    Just to throw another bone out there for those of you who think Monette is a gimmick, what do you think about making different length mouthpieces for different pitched horns?

    Anyway, hope to hear more about these subjects, and thanks for your responses.
     
  6. uatrmpt

    uatrmpt Piano User

    373
    10
    Nov 29, 2003
    AL
    Ok, I'm not bashing on Monette's here, but I wonder what would happen if one were to to go any of the other extremely reputable mouthpiece makers and had a piece designed with the very large throats of the Monettes. I'm not talking about getting an existing piece reamed, but designed from the ground up with a large throat in mind. Imagine a GR, Warburton, or Stork with a 19 throat! Of course the sound would be huge and the cost would be less. Since no one has done that, however, we can only speculate as to how well these pieces would play.

    As an experiment, I'm going to take my old Bach 3C and get it reamed to the throat size of a CG 3 and see what kind of improvement to the sound that will make.
     
  7. B15M

    B15M Forte User

    2,459
    29
    Dec 30, 2003
    Monroe Ct.
    When I switched to Monette mouthpiece the change for the better was immediate. It took about six months to get used to but even the first day it was better.

    As far as Mr. Monette being a marketing genius, he is. That has nothing to do with how well his horns play.

    I think that the mouthpiece has to be matched to you and the trumpet. The notes will be in different places but you should be able to do what you could before.

    From what you are describing I would recommend a trip to the shop.
    A lesson with a pro is about 100.00 to 150.00.
    A plane ticket is about 100.00 to 150.00.
    You will learn a lot and have a good time and get the correct mouthpiece if you decide to get one.
     
  8. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

    5,915
    10
    Sep 29, 2004
    USA
    dear Diz,

    Permit me to disagree with your point that if one "plays correctly" you don't need a mouthpiece that does what Monette claims. The whole reason for coming up with the mouthpieces is to give greater ease of playing to those who do play correctly.

    I have a great number of folks that come in for lessons, coaching, what have you and often I'll pick up their equipment to demonstrate a technique and several things will happen. I'll have to use the same false-fingerings they do and/or I'll generally have to do quite a bit more lipping up on high notes above Bb ( I mean concert Ab). In short, the habits that I've gotten rid of have to be reinstilled temporarily to finish the demo if my horn's not handy.

    I find this to be even more so since I started playing the Prana horns and mpcs. In fact, the times in performance when my pitch was not where it was supposed to be, I can remember vividly that I was tight for whatever reason. Who knows, took a cheap breath, conductor did something distracting to throw me a bit... you know how it goes.

    The acclimation period is a time to reassess the way we do all those basic things we've all done to make things happen on the horn. Just drilling a larger hole isn't going to accomplish what Monette spent all that time in R and D creating these things, sorry. It's way more than that. it's a balance between cup, throat, backbore, length of stem, weight, and later the post-plating adjustments. What's that balance? I don't know but he does, fortunately.

    I generally don't get into Monette/ not-Monette posts because I'm closely related to the company and no matter what I say it's going to come off as shilling for Dave. Well, fine. I'm secure in my experiences and tend not to open my mouth about stuff unless I do actually know something for a fact. The facts are there is something to the varying lengths of his mpcs, the time it takes to adopt new habits to paly his equipment, and the huge time committment to ensure the kind of workmanship before a horn leaves the shop. Are there horn's of his that look like crap even though they play well? Yes, because in the early days there were many prototypes sent out that were bought as they were sent out and many of us didn't want to send them back to Chicago once we got our hands on them. Besides, the funky look was sort of fun and cool.

    So, no, the acclimation needed by most players is not bogus for the reasons I've described.

    ML
     
  9. MPM

    MPM Pianissimo User

    247
    0
    Nov 10, 2003
    Acclimation

    Manny,

    Interesting and thought provoking post of yours. This past year "HAS" shown me that some times an acclimation period, when a player is changing something in his set up, mpc or trumpet, is correct. So I'm saying I agree with what you said, and hope to see this subject discussed in a logical, civil manner.

    A little over a year ago I went to a fairly exteme change in my mpc. From a Reeves S cup, #28 bore hole, 69 bb --- to ES cup-#30 bore hole-692s bb. It took quite some time to get use to the adjustment, learning to back off, and not work harder than I had to.

    So I find your post very interesting and glad to have found it on the forum.

    We have not met, but have a very good friend ij common up there in MN ... Mike Supple.

    BTW, I heard Doc Severinsens show with the Orchestra up there was amazing!!! A friend of mine was in the 3rd row, and said Docs playing was outstanding. He sounded like he did 20 years ago. Was Tony Scodwell on the gig as well?

    Regards .... Michael
     
  10. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

    5,915
    10
    Sep 29, 2004
    USA
    Dear Michael,

    One of the reasons I have hung in with this forum is because of the quality of debate/discussion/rap, whatever. Outside of the Cage it's been a good place to be.

    Anyway, glad to hear you know Mike S. We've been friends for quite a while, now.

    No, Tony wasn't playing Doc's show... I was. Since your pal was in the third row, he couldn't see us in the back. I agree with his assessment: Doc sounds outrageous. The big band stuff we did together was inspiring. I told him after one of the shows how fantastic we thought he was playing and he just sort of shrugged and said "Well... okay, thanks." He's always so effusive with his praise of us backing him up but when we compliment him he almost seems embarrassed that we make such a fuss over his screaming tones.

    But that's our man Doc, a class act.

    Back to topic.

    ML
     

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