Mouthpieces

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Crunch, Sep 12, 2007.

  1. Crunch

    Crunch New Friend

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    Please don"t laugh at this... If anyone read my introduction thread, you know I am a guitarist, ocasionally playing a trumpet. And only lately did i realize that mouthpieces make as much of tone as trumpets... Ok, mybe not as much, but alot. I have a shallow mouthpiece, think it is amati, with a small hole in it. Couldn"t get it higher than e2. (ok, I am a guitarist, remember? And i don"t practice.) Well, this guy came to help our band out, to play a trumpet on this gig. Tried his trumpet, felt reborn. Then he saed that I have a lousy mouthpiece. And a trumpet, yeah. So, i kinda wanted to ask, if I want (and I do) to play higher and louder, what kind of mouthpiece should I get? Any advices? Overall tone doesn"t matter. Not that anyone cares about tone on a kind of gigs where we play...:D So, any advice fellas? What kind of a mouthpiece?:dontknow:
     
  2. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    The only answer to higher and louder is practice! It is no different with your guitar-you can buy fast strings but if your fingers are mush, that is what comes out.

    The best mouthpiece to start is generally something like a Bach 7C or Yamaha 12B or 13B. They are "standards" and once you have spent some time on them, any reasonable teacher can help further. By the way, tone ALWAYS matters - even on grunge gigs.

    Hopefully a new mouthpiece will lead you to more practicing!
     
  3. trumpetnick

    trumpetnick Fortissimo User

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    Though I will second everything that Robin said, I feel urged to add, that a mouthpiece that is too shallow, have a small cup diameter and have a tiny throat can be a pain in the ..... A good mouthpiece that suits you is very important. Though Robin's comment on standard's is absolutely right, you may start on a bigger or smaller mouthpiece depending on the size and shape of your lips and jaw. If I was you, I would not go for a mouthpiece safari without someone to help my choice like a trumpet teacher or an experienced trumpet or other brass instrument player (a trumpeter is strongly prefered).
     
  4. godchaser

    godchaser Banned

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    Sounds like ya'll are havin' some real good times there Crunch. Brava-

    No doubt your right in realizing you need practice time, (probably it's tuff to find the time), and maybe thinking too, that a rent to own on a good horn might be the ticket to wanting to play more.


    Some innovative design here:

    The New Asymmetric Trumpet Mouthpiece

    "This work resulted in an improved mouthpiece for brass instruments, the "Asymmetric", that's designed to extend most players' high range by as much as seven semitones while retaining the flexibility, sound quality and intonation of currently available conventional mouthpieces." -John Lynch

    Essays by Nick Drozdoff:

    How To Play A John Lynch Asymmetrical Mouthpiece

    The Basic Physics behind the John Lynch Asymmetrical Mouthpiece

     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2007
  5. trumpetnick

    trumpetnick Fortissimo User

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    GodChaser,

    I don't like embarrassing other people on the net, but have you ever tried those? and why on earth would you introduce those to a novice? They are specialist mouthpieces and not even all jazz and high note specialists would agree on those, so it is not prudent at all to introduce those to a guy who has not even learnt the basics of the brass playing. It is like putting someone in a Formula1 who has never driven a "normal" car...Go do some playing yourself, make some experiences and then try to give advices to other people.

    The fact, that someone says (even if the guy is Nick D).that something is good does not constitue a reason to recommend it to anyone...
     
  6. godchaser

    godchaser Banned

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    trumpetnick- i don't give advice to anyone, particularly things i'm profoundly aware. If Crunch wants a mouthpiece that'll help'm blow a hole through the people in the front row, who are we to argue about it. :)

    Given the physics at play here, one's opinions or endorsements are irrelevant. Which was my meaning of 'advice'. There's no need to be giving advice when the facts are universal. In this instance, the physics of design, are- what they are. (The mouthpiece works as intended.) As well, your applying deeply flawed rationale in supposing innovative design's inhibitive of quality learning -it should go without saying that that's just not the nature of things. In any arena. To suggest otherwise is saying good sense is abandoned when it comes to trumpet playing.

    You should read Lynch's site. As well, Nick's essays. It's good learning there. You'll note there's young beginner players making good use of John's designs. ('Formula One' just doesn't add up to good parallel.)

    Beyond that, my suggesting to Crunch that what seemed to be his inclination to get some good equipment, may be just right, to inspire his finding the time to practice. Which he's apparently mullin' over as well.. all be it that his present intentions of play, may just be blastin' some good fun, and loud as hell notes now and again!

    HAAAA- Good show Crunch! :)

    And apologies for talking about you like you ain't in the room. Or sounding patronizing in my having to explain myself here. Which i wouldn't have any need for, if not for greatly valuing my interaction and learning here.

    You need to settle back and take in the big picture trumpetnick. If there's something else that's got you leaning on me, just speak to it. There's no problems here. But don't approach me sideways like that with statements of flawed acceptance in thinking- and have i used the mouthpiece, to run off with your bad feelin's. I got no interest.

    Neither of which is relevant by any estimation. Good equipment'll never be more than that, or innovative design either.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2007
  7. trumpetnick

    trumpetnick Fortissimo User

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    My point there, Godchaser, was that Asymmetric mouthpieces does not suit everyone and for someone to look out for those, means that he made a thorough research and knows exactly what he is looking for. It means an extensive mouthpiece safari. The Assymetric design is rather contentious and though it works prefectly for Nick D. for whom I have a great deal of respect and admiration, many great trumpeters have found much more comfortable the "standard" design even if does apply to Mps like GR's or monette. I tried some myself and though none of them was Lynch's I new very quickly that this was not my stuff. I may try them again one day if I feel that playing a dubba C is not enough but for the moment my present Mp is working great. I have seen the Lynch's site few months ago, so it is not really new to me.

    To sum up, my idea was that it is not be a good idea to start the MP safari with the assymetric design. That's my opinion. I am sure that many of the practicing trumpet teachers on the site would agree with me. And even if they don't I am rather unlikely to change my opinion.

    Crunch,

    I don't know what your repertoire is, but you are very unlikely to play above top F. Most good MP and some serious practice will allow you to do that and as Rowuk said, sound is always important. You may try those Lynch's mouthpiece and probably you should but be aware that every mouthpiece need some adjustment/acclimatisation time.

    My prudence is not motivated by any bad feelings I may have to you, godchaser (cause I never met you and don't care either) but by my practice. Novice and amateurs have taste for strange things which may sounds like a gadget (though it may not be the initial intention of Mr. Lynch) and soon after the first good impression they may have found themselves stuck with something fancy but inappropriate. Take attention on what you wish for you may found your wish granted....

    That's why an experienced player advice on place, who can see and hear what is going on may be very useful, whatever is the final choice: Lynch, Monette, GR, Bach, Yamaha, Schilke, Denis Wick or whatever else.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2007
  8. veery715

    veery715 Utimate User

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    The endless search for the holy grail continues! For trumpet players it is high notes and mouthpieces.
    But, for some trips there simply are no shortcuts. Work (practice) cannot be replaced with equipment. Mouthpieces included when buying a new trumpet are usually a 7C (Bach or equivalent), for the simple reason that it is the best fit for the average beginner. One half-hour lesson with a competent trumpet teacher will reveal if a 7C is good or not. Rent a horn with a 7C, Crunch, and get that lesson.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2007
  9. godchaser

    godchaser Banned

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    Understood tn-

    I never said otherwise, to your points of negotiating good learning.

    To that, the reason these mouthpieces are 'contentious' is because they're not the mouthpieces most everybody has inherited by script. Or have had to make unwanted adjustments to use'em, as a result.

    This isn't suggestive of 'gadget' equipment, or shortcomings of design soon to be revealed. That's poor retreat of argument to imply innovation's more or less than simply the efficency of design. There's no reasonable notion that these mouthpieces don't work like they're supposed to. Physics doesn't cease to exist because a player's been brought up on different equipment. And there's no way quality equipment thwarts good learning. Just isn't possible.



    C
     
  10. lmf

    lmf Forte User

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    Crunch,

    I would go with Rowuk, Veery and Trumpetnick on this one. Keep it simple by going with the standard mouthpieces then let your teacher guide you from there. The mouthpiece that godchaser talks about is liked by some, but does not work for everyone. I would not recommend it for a new player by any means, but only for one who has played awhile. You should consult a teacher for an opinion before shying away from the standards.

    As Rowuk said: "The best mouthpiece to start is generally something like a Bach 7C or Yamaha 12B or 13B. They are "standards....."

    Best wishes!

    Lloyd
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2007

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