Multiple Problems

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by tg610, Aug 17, 2010.

  1. tg610

    tg610 New Friend

    Aug 15, 2010
    oh alright. Ill try it tonight at rehearsal. Thank you! :play:
  2. Satchmo Brecker

    Satchmo Brecker Piano User

    Jul 19, 2010
    More than once you've basically told posters not to rely on "internet recommendations tha may differ" and get a teacher. If that's the case, why are you even on this forum? I'm sorry, but I've found plenty of posters here giving great advice. To just say "go get a teacher, don't listen to opinions in this forum" doesn't help.
  3. elduque

    elduque New Friend

    Jul 8, 2010
    Upstate, NY
    While I can't speak for Mr. Rowuk (nor does he need my defense), I can see where he's coming from. Too often people come to the forum to have other people solve their problems (which is fine), but they don't take responsibility for their shortcomings. They expect everyone else to fix their mistakes, but are unwilling to put in the hard work, the diligent hours, and the methodical practice. They're looking for "shortcuts" to success, and I believe Mr. Rowuk is of the mind that there are no shortcuts, you have to play play play! No cheat sheet, no skipping steps, just face-time.

    So, I believe that his advice is quite helpful. It keeps people honest with themselves, and puts the ownership where it rightfully belongs. If you want improvement, stop searching the forums for gimmicks and start being introspective of your own playing. Your own ears are ultimately the only ones that can improve your tone quality. Might as well start using them.
  4. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

    Oct 26, 2003
    I think that it's also due to the fact that some of the "advice" handed out on an online forum needs to be taken with a large lump of salt because it's coming from people who, if compared to the OP with the chops problems, might not be markedly better themselves.

    I've always been hesitant to give chops advice, mainly because much of what I have accomplished with the horn has been done through a lot of trial and error, and the truth is, I don't know exactly what's going on with my chops. Having said that, there are some fundamental things that can be done, and with hard work and attention to detail, many people can fix a lot of their own issues in the practice room if they change their approach. Seriously - is a teacher going to show them exactly how to place their lips, or is a teacher more likely to give them some concepts to work with, and allow them the latitude to dial things in for themselves?

    I think that a lot of players get caught up trying to learn too many things at once and they never really focus on some of the basic specifics of tone production and articulation. I think this comes from a general lack of patience in a society that has become one that wants instant results. Well, there is never really anything instant or quick about learning to play a musical instrument. Sometimes you just have to back off a bit, have some patience, and put in the work on some basics, and often times the intervention of a teacher is not needed.

    Just an opinion of course, and you know what they say about those.
  5. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    All of this theory is wonderful, For players not listening to their teachers (YET), the best bet is to just start playing again. Preferably fun stuff because if they have the dedication to quit for a month after braces, then there is a motivational issue anyway.

    This is why I have offered NOTHING here in the way of replacement lessons.

    I think that many TMers do not understand the dynamics of the human mind. Treating every poster here like the potentially focussed geek just doesn't work. This player just needs to start playing again. Period. They have a teacher - hopefully with the stuff to bring a player that has lost their braces back. All of the normal chop building stuff will come when school starts. Let's just get this poster started again with easy, fun stuff.

    A killer 45 minute balanced routine is guaranteed to keep new players from doing what is really necessary - just knocking the rust off and getting started again.
  6. tg610

    tg610 New Friend

    Aug 15, 2010
    I do have a teacher; shes really good. Its just that i havent taken lessons since the end of school (ill be starting up again soon) but i think that the more advice, the better. And at TM i can get multiple opinions.
  7. wolfmann

    wolfmann Pianissimo User

    Aug 19, 2010
    As far as marching band is concerned you are talking about Bounce.
    You need to SMOOTH out your steps dont pound the ground.
    Without being there its hard to see what the actual problem is.
    Long tones helps you center your tone.
    PLAY with it,dont get all worried about it.
    I once took lessons from a guy during a Stan Kenton Class that played with Bill Chase,His name was Jim Oates(hope i spelled that right)
    He told me that if anyone heard him during practice they would have NO clue that he was a PRO.

    RELAX its cool just listen to what you are doing.
  8. Darrien

    Darrien Pianissimo User

    Nov 27, 2008
    St Vincent (West Indies)
    While I understand your interpretation of Rowuk's comments, I must say that I have found him to be among the more insightful commentators on the site. I think he gives excellent advice for the most part and I have even sought him out on different things through private messages. The thing is, he always reminds us that nothing said on the forum can be viewed as a conclusive diagnosis of any problems since we are only forming a mental picture through what is being said by the posters. We are not privy to watching them play and listening their sound for a more 'clinical' diagnosis. Yet Rowuk gives us some direction as to what we can assess/analyze for ourselves along with our tutors to see what works best.

    Also, I think it is indeed important to be careful how advice is given to persons who currently have tutors, for several reasons. Some advice can undermine the relationship the poster has with the tutor (who is actually physically present with the student), it can raise questions of the teacher's competency in the student's mind. Also, blanket advice doesn't work for everyone and the teacher's advice can well be the accurate advice FOR THAT SPECIFIC PLAYER'S PROBLEM. Persons really ought to be reminded to think of the information given on the site as a resource which allows them more room for thought and analysis which would in turn allow for greater discussion with their tutors and more educated decisions.
  9. wolfmann

    wolfmann Pianissimo User

    Aug 19, 2010

    Well said.
    It is very hard to give much instruction without being there for hands on advice,I notice a LOT of young players on here asking for advice hopefully we can all try to do what we can to help them.And lets not send a bad message to them by acting like internet keyboard warriors.
    Also remember that many cant afford a teacher and this is where they come for helpfull advice.
  10. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

    Sep 20, 2009
    New York State USA
    I can offer lots of advice too. I was once in your spot, having multiple problems with my embouchure. Through high school I sat 2nd and 3rd chair - cause I played out one side of my mouth and not centered. probably like the braces -- some things (change in embouchure) you just have to sort of learn over -- and that is difficult to have patience while you are expected to play - and while you are so young. So I say -- take the time to do it right, if you love to play the trumpet -- make the time to practice -- listen to your teachers. Maybe that means actually cutting out some marching band - I dont know. I sat out my senior year in high school to center my horn --- that was tough, but necessary.
    I have pushed myself many times to the point of frustration through the years and quit many times (I'm 45) - but time, patience, and realizing -- "everything" does not happen over night will be of benefit to you.
    I hope you can develop a "longer" term perspective than trying to fix everything overnight -- that will be the best advice you can have.

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