My observations and experience on Trying to find right embouchure

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by n8r, Jun 21, 2012.

  1. n8r

    n8r New Friend

    22
    1
    May 10, 2012
    No, I love a lot of Jazz. I personally find Dizzy and Miles sloppy, often, to my ears. There are ton's of Jazz or Jazzy-ish players I love. Sean Jones, Wynton Marsalis, Arturo Sandoval, Adam Rapa, Trombone Shorty, Rashawn Ross, just to name a few.

    I am a sloppy player. Calling Dizzy and Miles sloppy is not meant as a personal attack on them. It was just a point I was making that their playing doesn't do anything for me over all. Listening to their music is boring and uninspiring to me. I don't like what I've heard from them thus far.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
  2. n8r

    n8r New Friend

    22
    1
    May 10, 2012

    The Callet method is one that you have to work at and develop over a long time to be able to master and for it to work. While I did spend a lot of time messing with different techniques, the one I have settled on for now, is one that once I discovered it, it worked instantly, comfortably, and naturally.

    I realize that I could benefit from paying for instruction. That is not the way I am choosing to proceed for reasons previously stated.

    Success is in the eye of the beholder. I mentioned earlier that I am already much better now in just a month back on the horn than I ever was in high school. I have already surpassed the level I was at then. No comparison. The handicap IS definitely being overcome without paying for a teacher. I am in this for the long haul and there's no hurry.
     
  3. n8r

    n8r New Friend

    22
    1
    May 10, 2012
    Thanks rowuk! I'll definitely check it out. This will be my next area of focus. The great thing is Im coming at the trumpet this time with no pressure to perform, as I don't play in bands or anything yet and I can take my time to get comfortable with getting my basics solid, tone, attack, breathing, etc. I can afford to have fun trying things without worrying about it screwing up my playing the next day.
     
  4. n8r

    n8r New Friend

    22
    1
    May 10, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
  5. n8r

    n8r New Friend

    22
    1
    May 10, 2012
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
  6. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon


    I didn't say ANY instrument was a DIY one (IMO) ...... I said, guitars, drums, voice, harmonica.

    There are many musical instruments that you'd have to be from another planet to want to try and learn by yourself (like violin, bassoon, or trumpet for example). Out of all of them, trumpet is probably the most difficult. You need to ask yourself why you want to make it even harder, by avoiding (in person) teachers .... most of whom can accelerate the learning process and have been working from "The Masters" (as you put it), like everyone else :)roll:).

    And really ... you should put some real miles into your Miles listening, he's got millions of miles of recordings, no tiny bits and bobs of "bad Miles" (your opinion) can diminish or tarnish the man's reputation. Back in the day, "Everyone wanted to be like Miles Davis" (pick a famous person for the quote, many many people have made the statement) .... It was, for other artists of the day, the ultimate in "COOL". Get some videos, concert footage, view a few biographies of Miles for the full impact. It was also visual and had a lot to do with his attitude ... best recording years: (for Miles, IMO) 1950's through 1970's.


    Turtle
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
  7. n8r

    n8r New Friend

    22
    1
    May 10, 2012
    I play guitar. IMO, the only thing harder about the trumpet is the initial fundamentals of tone production, breathing, etc where there is a steep learning curve to make the Trumpet sound decent. Mastering the guitar is very technical. Each instrument has its own challenges. To say one is harder to master than the other is hard to substantiate and a ridiculously bold statement, subjective at best.

    As far as listening to more miles, I did a youtube search on him and went through the first few pages of video hits. The way youtube works is that usually an artists best stuff receives the most views and shows up first. The most popular stuff is easiest to find. Youtube is a sort of tributary thing. For example, if you type in Bob Marley, you get all the main stuff he was known for and it gives you a good idea what drew people to him.

    If Miles was that great, why are there not a bunch of great recordings that show up when you do a search on youtube? Everything I saw was bad quality, sloppy, humdrum, boring, uninteresting to my ears.
    Can the guy even play without a mute? Perhaps back then everyone wanted to sound like Miles. How many people want to sound like him now? I don't know. There are SO many better sounding trumpet players to my ears today and not many sound like Miles to me. My take is that Miles is a nostalgic sound that many have attached themselves too. I personally don't think he's that great. A lot better than me though. I have to listen to myself, but I don't have to listen to Miles. I want to listen to stuff that inspires me. Miles depresses me and makes me irritable. Perhaps Miles and Dizzy have a lot of great stuff that I haven't heard, but what I've heard from them thus far is a disincentive to go digging to find it.


    I am in no need of accelerated learning. It's not a race. I'm taking my time enjoying the process and my personal development. I'm not advocating that others should avoid paying for lessons and I'm not trying to start a movement against the teaching profession.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
  8. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon


    :-)



    Okay, then. Have a nice day and good luck with the trumpeting.:thumbsup:


    Turtle
     
  9. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

    5,065
    1,005
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon

    Yes, Miles could play trumpet without a mute.

    And ...... you've misquoted me. I said "Everyone wanted to BE like Miles" (not play like him, because many of those other artists played other instruments besides trumpet and, well, you can see .... that wouldn't work). I don't mean to be so nitpicky, but, frankly, you sound more like a critic than a trumpet player and I hate to be misquoted.

    Again, have a nice day.


    Turtle
     
  10. kehaulani

    kehaulani Fortissimo User

    3,450
    2,705
    May 14, 2011
    Hawaian homey
    @n8r. ref Miles and Dizzy's "sloppiness", maybe you could listen with a different kind of ears. If you don't like that kind of music, fine. But these guys are creating - often - great art on the fly; in the moment. They're wire walking without a net. He's taking chances. Also what you won't hear from some of the players you might like for their consistencies, is how Miles is constantly manipulating his sound. His sound is very malleable. If you slowed a solo down a lot, you might hear several different manipulations of the same pitch. Yes, he does miss notes here and there, but I guess in what he does and how he does it begs the listener to ask one's self what, aesthetically, is more important, total control or risk taking. IMO there are other jazz players who, I suppose, one could call "cleaner" players. IMO many of these, I personally would call "sterile".

    If you've just been getting youtube hits of Miles in harmon mute, give this a try and tell me if this is sloppy playing. Man, the guy's all over his horn the full range of it. That takes amazing control:
    Miles Davis Quintet - Live - Four (1964) - YouTube

    Here's another reference from the same concert. Enjoy!
    Miles Davis Quintet - Live - Seven Steps to Heaven (1964) - YouTube
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2012
    turtlejimmy likes this.

Share This Page