new mouthpiece

Discussion in 'Mouthpieces / Mutes / Other' started by songbook, Mar 20, 2011.

  1. PatMurphy

    PatMurphy Pianissimo User

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    Aug 9, 2009
    Cherry Hill NJ
    What does your present MP NOT do?
    What change in sound would you like?
    In my case, I want a big sound but a Bach 1 was more than I could handle.
    I wanted a little brighter so I have been playing a Bach 3D which is a slighly shallower cup and it has been fine for years
    All my horn mouthpieces are 3s no matter the dup depth.
    Having said this I am about to try a Wedge sinceit semed to give me a fuller sound
     
  2. mbikulic

    mbikulic New Friend

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    Feb 3, 2009
    tampa, fl
    My teacher has been playing for over 50 years. His various experience includes performing with the New York Metropolitan Opera; The Cleveland Orchestra, American Ballet Theatre, Trinity Chamber Orchestra, Front Row Theatre, Playhouse Square Orchestra, The State and Palace Theatres (Cleveland Ohio) Some of the famous artists he accompianed include Luciana Pavoratti, Bob Hope, Jerry Lewis, Jay Leno, Sammy Davis Jr., Julie Andrews, Aretha Franklin, Johnny Mathis, Chuck Berry, Rodney Dangerfield, Lou Rawls, Tony Bennet, Perry Como, Wayne Newton, Dinah Shore, Bobby Vinton, Danny Thomas, Charo, Jim Nabors, Englebert, Milton Berle, Diana Ross, Bob Newhart, Robert Goulet, Rosemary Clooney, Sid Ceasar, Andy Williams, and Liberace. He has performed with famous groups such as; The Temptations, Four Tops, Mills Brothers, Seals and Crofts, Smothers Brothers, Gladys Knight, and the Pips, Three Irish Tenors, and the Moody Blues.

    Any questions? As for mouthpieces he says the asymetrical ones are 'crap' He said changing the tuning slide on a Bach from the D shape to a more rounded C shap is a joke. I was playing a Bach 3D and he got me into a Yamaha 14A4a, which has a very shallow cup and wide rim for more support on the lips. This is a great commercial mouthpiece and makes playing upper register almost effortless. Bach mouthpieces tend to have thin rims and when I play one now, my lips actually hurt. As for trumpets, my teacher still plays a beat up old Bach. He said every brand out there basically copied Bach trumpets, with a few minor differences. The Monet valves, the silver plating, the welds were all Bach's ideas. The Bach Strad is still the best selling, most widely played trumpet out there. Yeah, there are trumpets that can cost up to 10,000 (Monet) but they have little comparison to the original Bach. Do you think my teacher saw a lot of trumpet players over his career? I trust his word over anyone. Put that in your horn and blow it
     
  3. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

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    Jan 28, 2011
    Dayton, Ohio
    Don't let those stars in your eyes blind you. Keep experimenting with other combinations. Don't settle. Give it a try, young grasshopper.
     
    jsmiley89 likes this.
  4. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Germany
    If every one worked the same, your teachers experience would be significant. Because we all are different in practice habits, intelligence, tissue density, lung volume, body use and sound preference, what you state is NONSENSE.

    I am surprised that you haven't done at leat a bit of research. Most horns do NOT copy Bach. Thin rims? Your 14a4a is much thinner than the 7E Bach. Silver plating was around LONG before Vincent Bach started building horns (The History of Silverplate | eHow.com).

    Here is a link to the truth about Monel:

    What are Monel Valves? | Trumpet4u.com| Trumpets for Sale, Used Trumpets for Sale, Trumpet Repair

    Monel is a nickel-copper and zinc alloy that was patented in 1906. Its considered a ‘natural alloy’ since it can be produced by refining ore containing nickel and copper in the ratio it is found in the natural nickel-copper ore.
    Monel is more expensive than stainless steel and highly resistant to corrosion. Its popular in marine applications, eyeglass frames, and musical instruments.
    There’s an excellent story of monel entitled ‘A Century of Monel Metal: 1906-2006′, which contains this account:
    On January 30, 1906, U.S. patent 811,239 was issued to Ambrose Monell, then president of the three-year old Inco, for “a new and useful improvement in the manufacture-of nickel-copper alloys.” As is stated in the Monell patent, the process included smelting, “bessemerization,” calcining, and oxide reduction.While Browne’s plan to make German silver from the nickel/copper alloy was indeed possible, it was determined that the resulting alloy of about 70% nickel and 30% copper-the natural ratio of those elements in the matte ore-had some quite interesting properties as produced. The new alloy was silvery white, brighter than nickel, stronger than steel, and more resistant to corrosion in saltwater and sulfuric acid than bronze. In honor of the company’s president, the product was named “Monel” metal.

    So as far as Monette or Bach, I think that you would be much better off trying one before blogging such nonsense. You can't compare the two - they are so different in blow, sound and construction, that I say that they are complementary. If your teacher really is saying this stuff, he needs to spend some time here at TM to catch up with reality.

    My advice to the weak in experience: don't post unless you have really tried it. There are enough people here that have and BS like the mbikulic post just show a real need for information. He has really misunderstood just about everything significant.
     
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  5. jsmiley89

    jsmiley89 New Friend

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    Jan 23, 2011
    Iowa
    My first reaction to reading this is wondering what your approach is like. Obviously everyone has 'on' and 'off' days, but I find what I do in the warm-up GREATLY affects the quality of that day's practice. Do you have a set warm-up routine that you do 90% of the time? (I'm leaving room for the assumption that some days we all have to break routine to get stuff done)
    Try tracking what you do in the warm-up and comparing it to how you play that day!
    I'd love to hear any tangible results from this- let me know if you try it out! :-)
     
  6. jsmiley89

    jsmiley89 New Friend

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    Jan 23, 2011
    Iowa
    Thanks for the name- I'm not sure if he was playing one on some of his YouTube videos or not, but regardless he sounds pretty respectable! I've never known of a player like him using the asymmetrical mp's- thanks for enlightening me!



    Right on!
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2011
  7. songbook

    songbook Piano User

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    Apr 25, 2010
    jsmiley89, you hit the nail on the head. If I have a nice relaxed warmup, chances are I'll have a good day on trumpet. When I don't get that good warm-up, that's when all those bad habits come back to haunt me. The dreaded mouthpiece pressure is the one that does me in all the time.
     
  8. PatMurphy

    PatMurphy Pianissimo User

    222
    31
    Aug 9, 2009
    Cherry Hill NJ
    Many years ago I was playing a 7ish mp (no name so I did not know what it would be in a Bach)
    A university trumpet professor suggested I never go smaller than a Bach 3. He said the loss in upper register would come back after a bit of practice and it did. Nothing wonderful but high C and maybe a note or 2 more on a very enthusuatic day

    I am very happy I followed his advice. I played this 3C for years. I also used Bach 3 mp for my flugel and cornet on the theory that it wouyld be consistant pressure on my lip no mater the horn.
    After a while I wanted just a bit more brightness. I switched to a 3D and have used it for the past 5 years

    One great convenience with Bach is their numbering system makes sense to me. Smaller number, bigger opening. Letter = cup depth. D is shallower than C. They eveen publish a little pamphlet explaining all this. I can never make rhyme or reason with other manufacturers numbers or letters.
    Any help here would be appreciated.

    Some time ago I tried a asametrical and it did nothing for me

    I recently tried a wedge for a few minutes and am going to look further into it.
     
  9. songbook

    songbook Piano User

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    Apr 25, 2010
    Patmurphy, your mouthpiece journey seems alot like mine. Started out on bach7C, than switched to a Rudy Muck in Drum & Bugle Corps. Came back to the trumpet after twenty year break, and now I,m using a Bach 3C. Seems to work fine for me in the type music I play. Mostly big band and church. Thought I'd take a ride to Dillon's just to see if another mouthpiece can give me a slight edge. Nothing to drastic. By the way, I,m another Jersey guy. I reside in Ocean County. Good Luck! Al
     
  10. Donald

    Donald New Friend

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    Jul 27, 2010
    Windsor, Canada
    mouthpiece express has been selling cornet mouthpieces on ebay for a starting bid of $7.99 - they have some cosmetic plating flaws (some I can't find). I got a 10.5C, 8, 7C, 5C, 3, 1.5C and 1.25C - they are Conn - made to Bach sizing. I set them up with all my old mouthpieces and worked on the entire size range - I finally settled on the 1.5C. For that price a mouthpiece safari is worth it. Get a cornet to trumpet adapter and you can do your other horns too -- especially good for old comeback players like me
     

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