Olds recording offset 2nd valve-why are modern horns not made this way?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by JRgroove, Oct 5, 2015.

  1. JRgroove

    JRgroove Mezzo Piano User

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    The quest for trumpet/cornet knowledge continues...

    Olds recording offset 2nd valve-why are modern horns not made this way? I have searched about for the answer to this question. No luck so far. The 2nd valve offset seems like a good idea. Why are modern horn makers not doing this? It can't be only about cost. With new horns commanding $2000, 3000, or $4000+, there must be room in there somewhere. Perhaps a few other horns are made this way that I don't know about.
    Is it really just a gimmick?
     
  2. amzi

    amzi Forte User

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    I'm not sure it's a gimmick and I've been playing mine since my parents bought it for me brand new. I do like the off-set and think it fits my fingers better than in-line valve configurations. I should note that I have no problem playing my horns that have in-line configurations and switch seamlessly between my horns. If you really want a new horn with the offset I understand that Kanstul has the original jigs and has made at least one custom copy of the old Recording.
     
  3. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    It offers no performance advantage and is harder to build than a straight cluster. I think the Selmer Radial 2° is the optimal geometry. It is also more expensive to build.
     
  4. amzi

    amzi Forte User

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    I have always wondered what a horn with the Recording Offset and the Radial 2degree angle would be like. Somehow it just seems intuitive that it would reflect the most natural movement of the fingers. But talk about design challenges and expense--whew!
     
  5. ChopsGone

    ChopsGone Forte User

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    Good luck finding one, but the Lew Davis Autograph trumpet was just such a combination:

    Lew Davis "Autograph" Trumpet

    I'd even sell one of my Recordings to get one of these, if only to experience it. I love Recordings and Radials both so it's hard for me to imagine I wouldn't like this one.

    Update: while the one referenced above was sold some time ago, Trevor Jones currently has another one listed at only 699 pounds.
     
  6. richtom

    richtom Forte User

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    If pro players wanted them, someone would make them. There is no advantage to the off-set valve and as Rowuk stated, they are hard to build.
    I owned a Recording years ago and didn't care for it.
    Rich T.
     
  7. ChopsGone

    ChopsGone Forte User

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    The world needs more people like you. Recordings are getting way too expensive. I still have every one I've ever owned (starting in 1953) with the exception of one beautiful restored '53 I gave my granddaughter. Those and the three Super Recordings I own will be the very last horns to leave my possession, and hopefully I won't be aware of it when they do.
     
  8. richtom

    richtom Forte User

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    True. It does need more people like me.
    I am not a collector have only horns I need and actually use and never keep a horn that I don't care for. I sold off 5 high quality Bb horns when I got my Schilke B1. None of them did what the Schilke can do for me. Those horns are in the hands of people who play and enjoy them.
    It is a good thing that there are people who do collect GOOD horns (read: not old piles of crap beginner horns) because they are kept in good condition
    by folks who like them.
    Rich T.
     
  9. larry tscharner

    larry tscharner Forte User

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    Nice to see someone who calls em as he sees em. I too hold Olds vintage horns in high regard, but wouldn't go so far as to deem them as some sort of magical wand. This design was a neat idea but it didn't solve any sort of pressing problem. It didn't catch on and goes down in history as a variation that made it unique and obviously more collectible today. For those of you that swear by the Recording, more power to you. For the rest of us, life goes on. Best wishes.
     
  10. kehaulani

    kehaulani Fortissimo User

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    They don't make them anymore for the simple reason that, as America has grown more and more PC, it is considered indelicate having your middle finger extended like that.
     

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