One shortcoming of Musical Notation

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by trumpetsplus, Jan 10, 2015.

  1. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    Baltimore/DC
    The English language is totally convoluted. I know that the Brits think they have some kind of lock on speaking it properly, but still doesn't account for all of the absurdities and contradictions scattered throughout that are often totally dependent upon context and usage. Want your head to hurt? Check out this poem:

    The Chaos - Gerard Nolst Trenité

    Here are a few stanzas, just for grins:

    Dearest creature in creation
    Studying English pronunciation,
    I will teach you in my verse
    Sounds like corpse, corps, horse and worse.

    I will keep you, Susy, busy,
    Make your head with heat grow dizzy;
    Tear in eye, your dress you'll tear;
    Queer, fair seer, hear my prayer.

    Pray, console your loving poet,
    Make my coat look new, dear, sew it!
    Just compare heart, hear and heard,
    Dies and diet, lord and word.

    Sword and sward, retain and Britain
    (Mind the latter how it's written).
    Made has not the sound of bade,
    Say-said, pay-paid, laid but plaid.
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .

    It's a dark abyss or tunnel
    Strewn with stones like rowlock, gunwale,
    Islington, and Isle of Wight,
    Housewife, verdict and indict.

    Don't you think so, reader, rather,
    Saying lather, bather, father?
    Finally, which rhymes with enough,
    Though, through, bough, cough, hough, sough, tough??

    Hiccough has the sound of sup...
    My advice is: GIVE IT UP!
     
  2. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

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    Aug 7, 2013
    Lagos, Nigeria
    HWÆT! WË GÄRDEna in geärdagum,
    þëodcyninga þrym gefrünon,
    hü ðä æþelingas ellen fremedon!
    Oft Scyld Scëfing sceaþena þrëatum,
    monegum mågþum, meodosetla oftëah,
    egsode eorl, syððan årest wearð
    fëasceaft funden. Hë þæs fröfre gebäd,
    wëox under wolcnum, weorðmyndum þäh,
    oðþæt him åghwylc þära ymbsittendra
    ofer hronräde hÿran scolde,
    gomban gyldan. Þæt wæs göd cyning!
    Ðåm eafera wæs æfter cenned,
    geong in geardum, þone God sende
    folce tö fröfre; fyrenðearfe ongeat
    þe hïe år drugon aldorlëase
    lange hwïle. Him þæs Lïffrëa,
    wuldres Wealdend, woroldäre forgeaf;
    Bëowulf wæs brëme – blåd wïde sprang –
    Scyldes eafera Scedelandum in.


    (Count your blessings, Patrick! :-))
     
  3. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    proof in point! I did get a kick out of it. Thanks!

     
  4. bumblebee

    bumblebee Fortissimo User

    3,930
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    Jan 21, 2010
    Great Southern Land
    This may help the perplexed:

    http://www.stt.org/document.doc?id=2777

    Enjoy!

    --bumblebee
     
  5. Reedman1

    Reedman1 Piano User

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    Sep 5, 2013
    NY, USA
    To trickg and Phil986: YES! Beautifully said! And love the poems, both modern and Old English. Good stuff!
     
  6. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    With swing there are all kinds of iterations, from Glenn Miller triplets to Basie quintuplets (or thereabouts) and we find the same kinds of differences in Baroque music. The French inégal and the double-dotted (although not so notated) rhythms of Georg Friedrich Händel are such examples.
     
  7. aborgman

    aborgman New Friend

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    May 13, 2014
    Bingo.

    Consider the notation: I don't think he should get that job.

    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: Somebody else thinks he should get that job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: It's not true that I think he should get that job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: That's not really what I mean. OR I'm not sure he'll get that job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: Somebody else should get that job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: In my opinion it's wrong that he's going to get that job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: He should have to earn (be worthy of, work hard for) that job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: He should get another job.


    I don't think he should get that job.
    Meaning: Maybe he should get something else instead.
     
  8. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Virginia
    :-)
     
  9. therealnod

    therealnod Pianissimo User

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    Dec 30, 2014
    Try Chinese or Vietnamese. Tonal languages that depend upon diacritcal markings for pronunciation. You can practice for years and never sound right, and it is entirely natural to the native speaker. Sound goes up at the end? Different meaning from the same exact pronunciation that goes either level or down at the end, or circular. English, by contrast, is straightforward, which is why it is the universal programming language. Concise, efficient, and flexible.
     
  10. Reedman1

    Reedman1 Piano User

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    Sep 5, 2013
    NY, USA
    English... a programming language...? :huh:
     

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