Patriot Act

Discussion in 'TM Lounge' started by cornetguy, Dec 17, 2005.

  1. cornetguy

    cornetguy Mezzo Forte User

    797
    5
    Sep 12, 2005
    Saint Paul, MN
    So the Patriot act is up for a vote in the US congress today. I hope it fails. I also did in 2001. I saw it then and still see it as using 9/11 as a way to stomp on the Bill of Rights. They say it is only used against terriorists, but the definition of terriorist is so broad that it could be defined as anyone against the current regime (anyone think that President Hillary won't use it that way?), and the social political agenda of the people that bribe the congress. If the government cannot trust the citizens, then the government has no business governing us, and we need to throw all the blankity blank bastards out of office next year.

    What our congress doesnt get is that we could not and will never be able to do a damn thing to stop the terrorists. We are fighting a war against irrational people. So it makes a big show of doing something, to try to placate the voters and give the illusion of doing something even if they know it wont do any good. Some of the security measures in airports are an example of this. All the "Patriot act" does is give "Big Brother" more of an entry way into our lives and our "free" country
     
  2. DaveH

    DaveH Piano User

    335
    89
    Nov 27, 2003
    Absolutely correct. They will never be stopped in any conventional sense of the idea.

    The biggest problem in regard to this so-called problem is that people in the West think that inside every "terrorist" there is an American wanting to get out. The biggest battle is in the difference in the mindset and worldview of those involved. I do not believe that people in American fully understand the enemy. He is highly underestimated and his way of thinking and system of values(or lack thereof if you will) is not recognized. To win any war, the enemy must be fully understood and not underestimated. Same as Vietnam...

    They don't think, live, act, believe, or value as do Americans and other Western cultures. It will never end and never be won in any so-called conventional sense. Therein lies the permanence of the "battle." It is a battle that is not against a country or an army...it is a battle of the mind and worldview. That will allow it to go on forever - as long as the opportunity for the Western/Eastern world to exist in opposition goes on...
     
  3. Robert Rowe

    Robert Rowe Mezzo Piano User

    513
    7
    Dec 24, 2004
    Seen on a bumper-sticker: "Nuke 'Em, Dubya!"

    Robert Rowe
     
  4. 40cal

    40cal Forte User

    1,258
    0
    Dec 13, 2005
    Minnesota
    How soon we forget....
    http://www.newyorkmetro.com/news/articles/wtc/gallery/5.htm

    http://www.newyorkmetro.com/news/articles/wtc/gallery/4.htm

    http://www.newyorkmetro.com/news/articles/wtc/gallery/2.htm

    http://www.newyorkmetro.com/news/articles/wtc/gallery/16.htm

    http://www.newyorkmetro.com/news/articles/wtc/gallery/index.htm

    We did not ask for this war

    The people killed on 9/11 by those chicksh*t terrorists did not ask to die

    How has your life changed since 9/11?
    Have you been detained because you went to a flying school and asked how to fly a plane, but told them you didn't want to know how to land?
    Have you been to a truck driving school to get a CMV endorsement but lacked basic skills like communicating in English so you can be in compliance with federal law?

    These terrorists have not stopped planning an attack. We would be foolish to think that they have given up.

    We would be even more foolish to stop our efforts in detecting and preventing these attacks.
     
  5. Robert Rowe

    Robert Rowe Mezzo Piano User

    513
    7
    Dec 24, 2004
    Yo, cornetguy & DaveH --

    I was nearby when the 11th of September attack on the World Trade Center occured ... lost some friends there.

    We are at war ... apparently, you do not understand this ....

    "There is no known cure for stupidity ...".

    Robert Rowe
     
  6. MahlerBrass

    MahlerBrass Piano User

    366
    0
    Oct 1, 2004
    Houston, TX
    I don't think it should be revoked, but maybe revised a bit. I hear so many people b#@ch and moan about airport security taking forever, searching our bags, etc but when something happens they're the first to point the finger and say the security was too leanient I personally don't mind sacrificng a little bit if it means the citizens of our country are that much safer.
     
  7. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

    5,917
    24
    Sep 29, 2004
    USA
    Robert,

    You can say whatever you want but I don't think you have to infer folks are stupid for not agreeing with you. That's all I'll say about that.

    The fact is I agree with you that we are at war with a shady, clever enemy that wants to destroy us. I'm in favor of the Patriot Act and denounce Harry Reid's proclamation of joy that they killed it. I'm not planning to place any phone calls or communiqués to Osama bin Laden or his henchmen so I don't think that particular federal agency is interested in me. It would be a waste of time and resources.

    I'll put up with the airport hassles. I'll leave my pocket knife at home or in my luggage. I'll show up to the airport early. I'll dress so that I can get through the lines effeciently. In other words, I've adapted. It hasn't been that big a deal because I've planned for those trips.

    I do, however, want for terrorists tha plan to kill me and my family to have as difficult a time as possible. I want them to waste as much time as possible so that we might have a greater opportunity to catch them.

    ML
     
  8. cornetguy

    cornetguy Mezzo Forte User

    797
    5
    Sep 12, 2005
    Saint Paul, MN
    i am not saying to not try to keep the terrorists from attacking, i just think this is the wrong way to go about it. by taking away our guarnteed rights, in the name of fighting terrorism, the terrorists win.

    isnt it ironic, president clinton wanted the same things in his term and the republicans dennounced them. now that bush wants them the democrats who thought they were great when clinton proposed them are now dennouncing them and the republicans are promoting them... makes you wonder about the credibility of our elected officials.

    yes so far the patriot act has just caused hassels at the airport. but what happens if we get a president who decides that anyone who disagrees with them is subject to being held under the patriot act. Their goes freedom of speach, or that in the name of fighting terrorism to get rid of guns, (the terrorists will still have guns), the search and seizure protection is non existant anymore. In fact the only part of the bill of rights that is reasonably safe is the quartering one. maybe i am being parinoid, but i dont trust our gevernment right now and havent for a number of years.
     
  9. Manny Laureano

    Manny Laureano Utimate User

    5,917
    24
    Sep 29, 2004
    USA
    That's PRECISELY why we have the second ammendment.

    ML
     
  10. Mikey

    Mikey Forte User

    1,840
    2
    Oct 24, 2003
    Amen.
     

Share This Page