Pedal C

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by hhsTrumpet, Sep 16, 2012.

  1. coolerdave

    coolerdave Utimate User

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    Claude Gordon was big on pedals ... my instructor had gotten lessons from him. A solid instructor with alot of accomplished players and a solid player as well. I am not saying the pedals tones were the reason ..just some info.
    My instructor didn't make a big deal about not hitting the pedal C either... he said don't worry about it ad it will come around in time.
    I don't know this for a fact ... just my take on pedals. If you practice playing lower than the F# then the F# becomes less drastic and not the end of the instruments range. Sort of the opposite of Adam Rapa's "today's squeek becomes tomorrows note"
    I do agree some trumpets are easier to play the pedal C on then others. My Bach isn't and since it's my main ax ... it's the one that counts .. well to me it counts.

    Someone has to know how to rip a pedal C on this site
     
  2. ultratrumpet

    ultratrumpet Piano User

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    Learn to correct way to approach and correctly play the pedals, the 'Claude Gordon' way, it's explained in Bill Knevitt's recording, "How To Develop Your Range To Third Pedal C", mp3 download /$3 and Bill's book "The Truth About How To Play Double High C On Trumpet" has a detailed explanation to accompany the recording in Chapter 4 "Bottoms Up" available at: http://www.latorremusic.com
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2013
  3. coolerdave

    coolerdave Utimate User

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  4. ultratrumpet

    ultratrumpet Piano User

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    Once you get down to Double Pedal C (The Great C), that's as far as you need to go because little else is developed beyond that point.
     
  5. D.C. Al fine

    D.C. Al fine Banned

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    Just as I said how to, that is how I go to C.
     
  6. ultratrumpet

    ultratrumpet Piano User

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    Often overlooked, the most important factor in playing pedal tones is the syllable approach: to think "ee-AW" going from high to the low notes to influence the tongue, taking a big comfortable breath, along with dropping of the jaw "slightly", also, relax all your muscles, keep the wind moving, keep the lips vibrating and together, and slide the mouthpiece slightly higher on your upper lip. Don't worry about the aperture and spreading your teeth, they'll take care of themselves.
    Do not push the lips forward in trying to produce a "loose vibration". Do not roll the lips out in any way. Do not use alternative fingerings.
    You will notice that there are three different feels for each pedal register and in time, crossing these register breaks will smooth out and disappear after several months of correct practicing.
     
  7. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    Honestly -- I am not a total nut job on pedals. perhaps that is because it is easy for me to go to the Pedal C (if that is the C below the low F#, as it seems to read here). Actually my notes below the staff are good, clean, and FF - if I want them to be. Most of that is relaxed center vibratory lip mass, and firm corners with volumes of SLOW LAZY AIR -- well that is how I describe it.

    My opinion is that long tones help tremendously in developing high range -- I mostly use pedals as a warm down, or to relax my lips and get the blood flowing.
    now doing soft long tones (in the staff) --- that helps me to determine relatively the same feeling (vibration, lack of pressure, and aperture setting) that can be SORT OF used on high range.
    That being said -- last summer I had an usable High A, as it appears on some recordings to friends -----------This year, I suck with only a high F that is usable, and WHY??? the pedals are still good, but I have been slacking on the long tones, and cut my practices down to a mere hour this past month. ----- well for me, it is the long tones, and scales and lip slurs that make the difference (((you got to do the time -- IMHO))) ROFL ROFL ROFL

    so, I am NOT convinced that you really need a great pedal C
     
  8. ultratrumpet

    ultratrumpet Piano User

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    There are many things we don't need, like twice as much wind power as the trumpeter that sits next to you in the band. Developing your wind power twice as much as that of the next fellow means you play with half the effort. Having a solid pedal C develops wind power, produces a big characteristic sound in all registers, sets the embouchure in the correct position, adds in developing the upper register, and relaxes the lip.
     
  9. Local 357

    Local 357 Banned

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    Are you saying that constricting and opening the mouth cavity BEFORE the air even reaches the lips is a good thing? Because this is what you're advocating. The syllable technique is kind of like putting a kink in a garden hose. Except that you won't really do this at all anyway. In order to actually speed up the air to play the upper tones as you've described you'd need to make a perfect seal with tongue between the upper teeth. Doable but very difficult. And a waste of good energy.


    "All your muscles"? Aren't the abdominal muscles which put air through the instrument required?




    Please explain how Bud Brisbois played well articulated Triple C's while using more lower lip than upper. Explain how this kind of advice could "benefit" someone predisposed to using more lower lip.




    This is consistent with your advice so far. Which has, essentially thrown physical law at the window. As if by playing the trumpet we become immune to the effects of gravity, dimension, mass, volume etc....





    Explain please my very solid High A (above High C) yet I'm not playing pedals much at all these days. Nor back when i did was much able to play them without using alternate fingerings.

    Explain how you and the system you advocate are capable of knowing the "correct practicing" technique.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2012
  10. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

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    Meaning, of course, that it is the second space in the bass clef and below mfrs specs for the trumpet range. Not at all hard with a bass trumpet, tenor trombone, or euphonium.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2012

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