Purpose behind heavy caps, buttons, and valve bottoms?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Repair and Modification' started by Mark_Kindy, Feb 26, 2012.

  1. Mark_Kindy

    Mark_Kindy Mezzo Forte User

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    I understand that sometimes one is trying to add weight to the horn with the heavy valve add-ons... but what exactly is intended here?
    The weight doesn't seem like it's in a calculated place to affect how the horn handles the air, but is it this? Or something else all together?
    I just seem to be missing something with this.

    Thanks,
    Mark
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2012
  2. patkins

    patkins Forte User

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    With what little I've read, they will change the tone of the trumpet, mush like other tone type devices used on trumpets. Stones on Canonball Stone series. Or the tone button on the Shires Destino III. I've never used them, as I am alredy happy with what I have.
     
  3. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    I do believe the heavy valve caps also (according to some) provide an easier slotting in the upper register. someone here will tell you why -- but it dampens the vibrations or something like that (you know because the upper register - the slotting is closer) so dampening the vibrations will help you slot better ---OK, that is my NON-technical take on that -- but it is suppose to help.

    ps. my King Silver Flair is heavy - much heavier than my OLDS Super -- I once tried "dimes with the holes drilled in them, placed in the bottom caps" - but it made NO difference in the slotting of the King -- I think that particular horn is already "maximized" for playing proficiency ---the only improvement can be made to the horn --- BY the player, practicing and applying his/her talents to the "equipment" as it was presented by the manufacturer.
    practice for improvement- what a trip!! ROFL ROFL ROFL
     
  4. patkins

    patkins Forte User

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    Ok, You know something I didn't. You deserve real rep points for that!
     
  5. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    in my "vintage" recollection of some past readings, that seems to be the just of what "heavy valve caps" could do for your horn --- if you didn't practice enough, then you usually look for GIMMICKS to make you play better --- yes, I have tried some of those things myself ROFL ROFL ROFL
    and Mark is also correct --- I believe (somewhere in my books on trumpet and music) people hold the trumpet differently, or some have added WEIGHT to balance the horn, I think so you hold it without forcing it into your lips -------------------of course, I think it would be better to "just learn" how to play the horn in the first place -- but some people add stuff ----psychologically speaking -that may actually help them "THINK" they play better!!!!!!!!!!!! ROFL ROFL ROFL


    ps. to the people who pimp their horn, and put on heavy valve caps and such -- if that helps you -- AWESOME -- please do not send hate mail, FOR KT just expressing his opinion -- he really is a great guy, even if he has to say so himself!!!!!!! ROFL ROFL ROFL
     
  6. Brekelefuw

    Brekelefuw Fortissimo User

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    Those cannonball stones are snakeoil times a thousand.
     
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  7. Mark_Kindy

    Mark_Kindy Mezzo Forte User

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    Oh, yes, the ever elusive slotting. I figure just get another horn. I agree with the opinion that psychology may have more to do with it, and that's cool with me.
    Tone, that's interesting (I haven't heard of what you mentioned, Dr. Atkins). I'll look into that.
    I'm not interesting in pimping my horn, I'm just trying to understand the mind of a horn-pimper XD Just wanted to get that disclaimer out of the way.
    You could call me an "au naturale" kinda guy ;)

    Thanks for your posts!
     
  8. richtom

    richtom Forte User

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    Physics apply to any type of device or weight added to a trumpet. The extra weight will effect the instrument in some way or another. Weight on the bottom of the valves does have an effect on the slotting and/or response of the horn. Whether it is an improvement or detrimental will depend on the player and the horn.
    I had a French Besson Classic which is a Kanstul built to Dennis Najoom's specs. It had a 37 bell and a Najoom leadpipe and it came with extra heavier caps and a rounded tuning slide. I found the "straight-up" version played the best. Adding weights to all the valves, one or two in various valve combinations did indeed change the horn. I felt it did nothing but alter a very fine design to a less responsive horn. The rounded tuning slide made the horn a bit more open, but again, not to my liking.
    The real issue I had with this horn was the balance in MY hand. It never felt quite comfortable and I sold it to a young high school trumpeter and included all the extras for him.
    If you can find a French Besson Classic, either the Bb or C, they are very fine horns and can usually be had for much less than I believe they are really worth.
    I have found that if I really like the instrument as it comes, tweaks to it usually don't add anything to the well-designed instrument. Everyone is different and what is not good for one player may be a substantial improvement for another - even if it may be only in the player's mind.
    RT
     
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  9. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    au natural' must be kind of em"bare"ass"ing at concerts, I am surprised you are allowed to do that!!! ROFL ROFL ROFL
    I also believe that patkins is correct --and that "heavier" caps and such -- make an otherwise "lighter" jazzier horn play a little more mellower and with a richer sound!!!!!!!!
     
  10. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

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    Don't get too wraped up in equations here. The Physics effected by the extra weight "in some way or another" resides in the physics (and chemistry) of the mind. When something "feels good", we "get into it" we let the tension OUT. We play (to some of you, this means slot:dontknow:) better. That is the Physics that applies here.
     

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