Questions about tuning

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by dpa10, Oct 6, 2009.

  1. dpa10

    dpa10 New Friend

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    Sep 15, 2009
    Hi all,
    I'm a newbie to the trumpet although I've been playing guitar for a while and have soem knowledge of music theory and a good knowledge of physics.

    I've searched high and low here on elsewhere about tuning and have read a wide range of descriptions about the main tuning slide.

    Here is what I've surmised.
    Please correct me if my assumptions are incorrect.
    If I put the slide in various positions I can always lip the trumpet back to pitch via embochure and air flow. It appears the key is to find the position of the slide that give optimum resonance for the fundamental pitch I'm tuning to to give me the richest sound.

    It also appears that there is a wide range of embochure and air flow combos for any given pitch and this effects the overall tone quality.

    I'm sure this is easy as pie for experienced players, but for those new to the intrument (and overly analytical :-)) I just want to know the best method for setting the tuning for optimum tone.

    I did hear somewhere that "bending" the pitch up or down and looking for the sweet spot is a good way to tune.

    Appreciate any attention to this.

    Thanks,

    Dean
     
  2. VetPsychWars

    VetPsychWars Fortissimo User

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    Nov 8, 2006
    Greenfield WI
    More or less correct as far as it goes. You'll also want to have the main slide in a position where the "trouble notes" can more easily be lipped into tune. That will depend on whether your first slide has an intonation aid or not.

    Basically, pick the position that gives you the best average pitch and resonance on as many notes as possible.

    Tom
     
  3. Bachstul

    Bachstul Mezzo Forte User

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    Jan 25, 2009
    There is much about trumpet playing common with singing, as far as "in tune" goes
    You have to hear the note in your head before you project it. Practice makes you "lock" in.
     
  4. dpa10

    dpa10 New Friend

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    Sep 15, 2009
    Hi Tom,
    Thanks for your response. What would you define as "trouble note?"
    I have an adjustable 3rd and 1st valve slide but I am not at a skill level wher they are of much use to me yet.
    I've watched videos on Youtube of Wynton Marsalis, James Morrison, Arturo Sandoval, Maynard Ferguson, Doc Severinson etc and I can't detect them using the valve slides while playing either.

    I'm just going to keep lipping the notes in but wanted to know how to optimize my horn so that it was easier to use. It seems like a subject that is either not important or that there is little info out there to read up on.
    From what I can gather, D is a tough one without using the tuning slide but I can lip a D on pitch fairly easily. Perhaps the tone would be better if i new where the 3rd slide should be for my horn on 3rd valve notes?

    just curious.
    The tech stuff tend to illicit a wide range of opinions.
     
  5. oldlou

    oldlou Forte User

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    As a youth,( early in the last century ), I was taught to always "lip 'm in". This is because in that era the only tunable on the fly valve slide that almost any trumpets or cornets were built with was the third valve. I learned on a top line pro make and model trumpet, the King Silvertone. That training has stayed with me and served me fairly well, but has kept me from becoming accustomed to a thumb saddle on the first valve slide. I currently play, as my prime trumpet, a Conn 2B New World Symphony, which was built with a first valve spring loaded trigger. My current problem with this horn is that the third valve finger ring is on the bottom of that slide, and my comfortable hold is arround the valve engine, making me use my pinky finger for third valve adjustments. For me, this is not only uncomfortable, but also, it is difficult to move that slide with the minor amount of strength in my little finger. This all means that I am back to "lippn' them in".


    OLDLOU>>
     
  6. VetPsychWars

    VetPsychWars Fortissimo User

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    Nov 8, 2006
    Greenfield WI
    You don't say what horn you're playing so it's hard to say. This is probably a good learning experience to do with your teacher and a tuner. Or even better, a tone generator program on your computer. Play along with the drone while bending up and down on your middle C until you're in tune with the drone and the horn is resonant (you can feel it vibrate in your hand). Adjust slide to get that. Then play the other notes with the appropriate drone and see what it takes to get them in tune with the horn also resonant. Not only do you want to play in tune, but you want the tone characteristics of all of the notes to be the same. The only difference you want is in the pitch.

    Tom
     
  7. muchan

    muchan New Friend

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    Jul 18, 2009
    about 1st and 3rd valve slide, I tune first with G (1st octave), open and 1-3,
    pulling both valves to match the pitch, then using E and A, try to match
    the pitches from 1-2 and 3, (pulling one and putting another in).
    I pull the 2nd valve also a little, before doing them, and when all matches,
    I assume slides are correct and don't touch anything after.
    (I'm not so advanced to dinamically tune higher notes with valves)
     
  8. dpa10

    dpa10 New Friend

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    Sep 15, 2009
    Thanks Tom,

    My horn is a Giardinelli 512. (Amati)
    Good enough for a beginner like me.
    I will try to find that resonating point you mention and I do use a tuner to verify pitch, my ear for tone.
    the handicap I have is that my embochure is only good at producing decent tone for short periods of time, as I'm new to it. It is thrilling to hit some nice notes that sound sweet, even articluating a few in a row.
     
  9. Bachstul

    Bachstul Mezzo Forte User

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    Jan 25, 2009
    Yea, thanks,.... Tom.
     
  10. JoeBlack

    JoeBlack Pianissimo User

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    Oct 12, 2009
    Northern Ontario
    Tom, can you suggest a few programs that are user friendly for such a task?

    God, I'm still stuck on midi tone generators:roll: I'm hoping today's are 512 bit symphonic masterpieces..:thumbsup:

    :play:
     

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