Reverse leadpipe Vs non reversed leadpipe?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by the newbie, Mar 18, 2012.

  1. DaTrump

    DaTrump Forte User

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    I have seen way to many people say this and I'd like to settle it. I did a blind test, eyes closed, ears covered and all, and reversed lead pipe SOUNDS freer, which is why I covered my ears, but isn't, or it isn't negligible. As Ivan said the bracing is further from the bell making it unstable. This instability means that it vibrates more, the sound travels more back to the player with standard lead. The sound travels more outward, not as much forward. However I will see many a poster argue with me. If I remember rightly, Rowuk believes something similar to that too. He is a lot more educated in this matter than I am, well many matters but he may be able to give better info on it.
     
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  2. hhsTrumpet

    hhsTrumpet Piano User

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    Pro: you might like it
    Con: you might not like it
     
  3. the newbie

    the newbie Pianissimo User

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    Thanks guys, i was under the impression that a reversed l/p was that the lead pipe was tapered the opposite way ie. gets thinner toward the tuning slide, boy was i wrong. So basically its that the tuning slide comes further back on the top, closer to the valve block. I don't think i like a reversed lead pipe. This is just another realisation i have slowly came across. Thanks guys.
     
  4. codyb226

    codyb226 Banned

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    I am curious, why?
     
  5. the newbie

    the newbie Pianissimo User

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    Well, i think it sounds shriller, which is the best word i can use to describe, and thats good if you want a big sharp brassy sound, ( i want a mellower sound almost flute like in the low register, (like Chet baker) and also the water accumulation factor would mainly be my reasons.
     
  6. codyb226

    codyb226 Banned

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    I like the reverse tuning slide. A lot. But I still do not think the slide has anything to do with the water build up.
     
  7. DaTrump

    DaTrump Forte User

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    Play a flute...actually don't, the world doesn't need more flute players! I've seen shriller standard leads and mellow reverses, the player is going to make the sound, but I do know the instrument does make a difference. There are numerous factors outside of the player that make an instrument sound the way it does, I wouldn't focus on one. Find a horn you like and play it till you sound like you want and have fun!
     
  8. richtom

    richtom Forte User

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    40+ years of playing at the very least a competent professional level has taught me a few things. (So have all of the terrific trumpeters I have had the pleasure of performing with over the years.)
    A properly designed horn will work best with the leadpipe is was designed around. Renold Schilke knew a thing or two about reversed leadpipes and his 50+ year old designs are still among the very best out there. You don't hear Schilke players complaining about the leadpipes on their horns, do you? Keep in mind, the much desired Committee was mostly the brainchild of Schilke himself.
    I've played or owned dozens of wonderful trumpets, most with standard leadpipes and believe the difference between reverse and standard pipes is player dependent and unless something is terribly wrong with design or construction, very subtle.
    EVERYTHING effects the overall design of a trumpet making the initial design of paramount importance. Move a brace a few fractions of an inch and one can change the character of a horn. Maybe for the better, maybe for the worse.
    Bob Malone uses a hidden reverse leadpipe and I believe Ken Larson does as well. (Someone correct me if this is incorrect.)
    As far as more condensation from a reverse leadpipe, I doubt that as I drain my Bach C and LA Benge 3X with their "normal" leadpipe every bit as often as the workhorse Schilke B1. That said, the mind is a powerful thing and if you believe it, it might be so. We are all aware that the mind is the chief antagonist of musicians, especially neurotic trumpet players. Any self doubt creeping in can destroy your playing. On the other hand, so can over-confidence, meaning unless you are a world class trumpet player, like a Vizzutti, Hardenberger, or Chris Martin, etc. someone will always be better than you.
    RT
     
  9. Pete

    Pete Piano User

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    I have a fantastic Bach lightweight that does not have a reversed leadpipe, and a Yamaha 8310Z that does. The reverse pipe does not make the horn play more open. The bracing is in different places, and the bell may respond differently because of this. You can find reversed pipes on Martins from the 30's, 40's, etc. and they are consider darker sounding horns.

    I also own a Los Angeles Benge 3X+ (.464) which has a standard leadpipe and plays as open as the a Yamaha 6340 ST (.463), and 739T (.463) which I owned in the past. If the horn plays the way that you want it to, that's what counts!

    Pete
     
  10. SteveRicks

    SteveRicks Fortissimo User

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    Being in the building business, I give Ivan's comments stong credibility. On identical horns, is there a more open blow?
     

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