Something i just can't figure out

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by garface, Nov 14, 2010.

  1. garface

    garface New Friend

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    Mar 7, 2010
    I'm both.
    And thanks i'll see about that
     
  2. Scatmanblues

    Scatmanblues Pianissimo User

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    Jul 19, 2010
    West Texas
    You're both at a high school level. That's VERY different than being a working lead player for many years or playing around town steadily for pay.

    You may know a lot more than any other trumpet player in your school, but that doesn't mean you know a lot about playing trumpet at a high level.

    I remember when I got to college, I thought I was hot stuff too. I had played "lead" for years, had marched drum corps, played in the jazz bands, and was better in my mind than even the other guys from my high school who got music scholarships. On the first day of college marching band, I was stunned to "earn" second part. Then in the first rehearsal, the director asked anyone who had been a section leader to raise their hand. Over 90% of the hands went up. The next question was, "Who played lead?" Almost the same number went up. I didn't earn a lead spot in any ensemble at college until my junior year. College is a different world. And guess what? If you ask pro players, or any who play regularly in real, working bands how many played lead at college, you'll see a similar proportion.

    It's like baseball. Only something like 1% of high school athletes play college ball at any level. Only 1% of college athletes make it to any level of professional ball. And only something like 5% of those who make it to the professional level actually become starters/regulars in the major leagues.

    I'm not trying to be harsh, but your first problem (from your tone) is that you aren't entertaining at all that the problem might be with you. If you really believe that you are playing "better" on a horn that doesn't even function correctly, I'm skeptical.

    There are big differences in the "blow" of horns with different bore sizes, and the balance of bore size, mouthpiece, and player can make a difference, but to hear that your playing has completely fallen apart on the Getzen as a result of playing on the Jupiter suggests to me that you've got a problem with your fundamentals somewhere or you've been using the smaller bore of the Jupiter as a crutch to developing good air support and chops for range.

    Different horns typically don't give you more or less range -what they do is make the range you have easier or harder to play well. If you've been playing the Jupiter for a while and the different resistance makes it easier for you to "cheat" the high notes, great. But if you don't have the same notes on the Getzen, you don't really have those notes in your range.

    In the real world, your range is what you can play cleanly and in tune at the END of the 2-3 hour gig, not what you can squeek out a few times to show off. I can still play double-whatevers if I screw in a Jet-tone and squeeze my cheeks for a few minutes, but that doesn't mean that when I go back to my normal rig and can't play a double-super-spectacular dog whistle note that there's a problem with my normal set-up.

    What I suggest is that you go back to the Getzen exclusively for a few weeks and really practice with it. Get the feel back for the horn and focus on playing with good intonation and air support. Play lots of lip flexibilities and scales at low volumes and "get your chops back" on the larger-bore horn. Play range studies, and re-build the upper register from the bottom, not from the top. THEN decide if you don't like the horn.

    Scatmanblues
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2010
  3. ComeBackKid

    ComeBackKid Fortissimo User

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    May 11, 2009
    Yorba Linda, CA
    Since you mentioned Long Beach, I assume you are in So. Cal. If so, make a run over to Anaheim Band Instruments (Lincoln and State College). Their brass repair guys are good, fast, and reasonable (hard combination to beat). They will make your Jupiter valves like silk (unless they are totally shot - in which case they can have them redone at Anderson plating but that takes about 8-10 weeks so you'll need to suffer through on your Getzen in the meantime).

    As far as feeling like you have to work too hard on your Getzen, often our ears pick up on certain sounds and on a different trumpet, you may be trying to make it sound like what your ears prefer and it just won't quite come out that way. If you play your Getzen exclusively for awhile, it will probably become easier unless there is something wrong with it, too. So, when you go to ABI, take both trumpets and see if they can diagnose them to they both play better.

    Good luck.
     
  4. garface

    garface New Friend

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    Mar 7, 2010
    Thanks a lot that really helps. just the reply i was looking for
     
  5. reedy

    reedy Piano User

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    Jul 31, 2009
    Wiltshire, UK
    I sort of know what you mean! this happened to me last year and a few years ago aswel, when I started learning I played a besson 928 cornet and did for 5-6 years until I managed to drop it and break it so the brass band I played with repaired it and gave me a Yamaha meistro which served me well and I passed my grade 8 on it 3-4 years ago but a few years ago I was the trigger stopped working so the band gave me back the same 928 that I originally learnt on. It felt very very open and I really diddnt like it so asked for the yam back. when I left this band to go to uni last year I joined the brass band there, they gave me a besson 927 or a 928, cant remember but I hated it again, I tried several mouthpieces going from bach 3c to very deep wicks and couldnt get the sound I wanted or the range I used to have on my yam and on my trumpet and generally, diddnt like it so found a old strad cornet which plays very very similar to my omega trumpet but with a huge MP it sounds how I want it to sound, like a cornet!

    My case isnt quite the same as yours but I do see what you mean.

    although I feel that if I practised on the 928 I would have got use to the open blow and the larger bore and it would have been ok but I had a contest in like 3 weeks time so decided to swap for an old strad which was just sat down in the band room doing nothing.....

    your 1st post seams quite misleading, you try and big yourself up as an amazing lead player whos toured the world for 20 years but in actual fact your not, your just a school kid.... please dont

    at the end of the day its upto you what trumpet you play on, if the cheep one feels better play that, if your pro horn does, play that. If I had a good pro horn I know id be playing that and not some cheep broken one.....
     
  6. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Dec 22, 2008
    Virginia
    Different horns have different playing characteristics. As has already been mentioned, differing set-ups will give you different sounds even on the same horn. I own a small harem of horns (14 so far) and like them all and what I've learned is that moving from horn to horn can be rough on the ego. My main horn is a Getzen 900H from the early '70's. I can't just jump to my '53 Martin Committee without making adjustments because the horns are so different. Find out from your director which horn is best suited for your situation. I would practice on the Getzen to improve the areas you mentioned, endurance and range. Having said that, what a horn cost and is labeled skill wise may have little bearing on it's playability. While my Ambassador will never replace my 900H, it's a very good practice horn even though it's a "beginner" horn. Definitely get the Jupiter fixed, It may be the horn for you. :play:
     
  7. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    Jun 6, 2010
    Oregon
    Quote from Tobylou8: "I own a small harem of horns ..."

    Oh, yes! I've been looking for a way to describe my, uh, my ..... gaggle of horns (like geese) .... my pod of horns (like whales) ...... HAREM. That's brilliant.:lol:

    Turtle
     
  8. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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    Dec 22, 2008
    Virginia
    Gotta give props to Rowuk for that "harem" thing.

    As a follow-up to the cost of a horn equaling quality, I played a horn that cost over 3 grand and it was REALLY stuffy in the lower register, to the point that D above low C was unplayable. Messed around with it for a bit to see if it was me (NO WAY ROFL) or the horn. Turns out the valves were out of alignment!! This horn was made by a company that makes as close to a custom horn w/o being such as possible. This horn had been special ordered from the maker yet arrived needing a PVA!! Don't ask who, I won't tell because that's not my point. The guy refused to pay for it (duh!), and the store wouldn't fix it. Instead they sold it to a schmuck who was just looking for a big name horn to impress his trumpet playing buddies. The moral is - PLAY BEFORE YOU PAY!!
     

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