SPEED TRUMPET ... Who are the fastest drivers?

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by turtlejimmy, Jul 8, 2010.

  1. lakerjazz

    lakerjazz Mezzo Piano User

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    I still feel that André's version of Carnival of Venice is the best (I've heard the studio version by Marsalis as well). Harry James's version is nice too, because it is so unique.

    My problem with Sergei's version is that from what I've heard (I seriously could be wrong), Sergei had to splice together different parts, because no one other than Mendez at this point can circular breathe while double tonguing.
     
  2. Markie

    Markie Forte User

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    Hi turtlejimmy,
    You might be able to get a DVD on Ebay called "Rapheal Mendez 8 Trumpet Films on DVD"
    Its extremely good and costs around $18.00. It gives trumpet instruction and even has an interview with him during his last days where he tells the story about getting hit in the lip by a door.
     
  3. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    Hi Markie.

    That's outstanding! Thanks for that .... I'll be looking to add to my collection.

    And CLIFFORD BROWN, as noted by a few earlier posts, could also play really really fast. I find his playing soulful an beautiful and when he steps on the gas, that great sound of his comes right along with him. It's so rich through all that velocity.

    Turtle

    Gotta get more CB!!!
     
  4. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    You heard wrong. Sergei has (and can still) played it live.

    Seriously, who would publish information like this about a big name player with a studio recording? The studio? Of course not. Who else would know what is cut? Nobody. In a studio situation these days several "takes" are recorded to give the recording engineer more material to "play with". That does not mean that they cut and splice to get rid of mistakes. Sometimes THEY decide that the tone is a bit more brilliant, the low notes have a bit more "grunt" or the accompaniment fits better. Anyone that understands the process with the attached marketing maschine as well as the idiot geeks that think that they can hear the grass grow, knows that money not music is at the middle of this. We can consider ourselves fortunate that there are such monster players that in spite of the ugly side, have so much talent that the end product can be so satisfying.

    Sergei has been to Germany several times and I make a point out of attending those concerts. Do the same, you will be impressed and not pass on the idiocy that belongs to the ignorant.
     
  5. trickg

    trickg Utimate User

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    Did you listen to the version of Carnival I posted by Maurice? Not to take proper respect away from Wynton - I have always thought he was an astounding classical player and on many recordings he did, I feel he set the new standard. However, this version of Carnival by Wynton is not quite at the same place as Maurice's - it's just not quite as clean and smooth.

    Turtle, were you referring to the recording of Maurice, or the recording of Sergei? I think they were done on cornet and trumpet, respectively.

    I used to think that Wynton and Maurice were at the pinnacle of what was capable for classical solo, virtuoso trumpet playing (not to be confused with classical orchestral playing - that's a different animal altogether) but that was before I had heard of Sergei Nakariakov - he holds his own with any of them. Of course there were guys like Mendez and Claude Gordon too, but I see those guys as the stars of yesteryear (and even Maurice's material has become somewhat dated) rather than the current standard.

    Of course no doubt I'm somewhat ignorant on the subject - admittedly, I don't listen to nearly as much trumpet music as I did 20 years ago. I'm a different musician now than I was then so my listen tastes have also shifted because of that.
     
  6. turtlejimmy

    turtlejimmy Utimate User

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    trickg,

    The recording of Maurice ... I guess what I'm really asking is what's that in the photo? The recording is pretty amazing ...

    Turtle
     
  7. lakerjazz

    lakerjazz Mezzo Piano User

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    Well in that case, Sergei has truly mastered the song. In fact, I had the story backwards. According to a member on TH, Mendez could play the whole thing when at home, but for the recorded version, he spliced it into four parts, because he was nervous and also wanted to save his chops for the rest of the recording session. If Sergei's played it live, well that is quite impressive.
     
  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Yeah, yeah, the experts at TH. I'd like to know where they got that "tidbit" of stupidity.

    Every time I read something like that, I get mad. 20th hand information that says nothing except how willing many are to keep myths/lies alive. If we follow Méndèz career and know ANYTHING about the industry back then, we see that he had no need to "save his chops" for the rest of the recording session. They just would have kept the orchestra an extra day back then. Today is different. They record multiple takes just in case the ENGINEER misses something. Like I posted before, WHO would have information like that? Would the few that really know better open their mouths? No.

    I guess some "experts" only feel important when they think that they can scratch at the reputation of one of the finest players ever. Those idiots deserve to be portrayed as they are: gossipers/liers not work believing.
     
  9. lakerjazz

    lakerjazz Mezzo Piano User

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    Of course I always take these stories with a grain of salt, but for some reason, this one at TH seemed more convincing. However, you are right; it could just be a well thought out rumor.

    "Dave Hickman addressed some of these issues in a post several years ago:
    _____________________________

    Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:39 pm Post subject:

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I don't want to diminish anyone's admiration for Mendez, but his sons told me this story several times in various conversations.

    Rafael worked very hard on the Paganini and could play all of it pretty much flawlessly, at home. Normally, his two sons did not go to their dad's recording sessions because of school. But, on this occasion, they were really anxious to hear their pop record it, so they arranged to miss school that day.

    They said that Rafael was very nervous about the recording of the MOTO. He had never performed the piece in public, nor even rehearsed it with an orchestra. At the breakfast table that morning he decided to record it in four breaths. (Still pretty amazing considering that the piece is over 4 minutes long!)

    When he got the studio, he marked the best splice points in the score. He quickly wrote out a triangle (percussion) part to be played. This was so that when the editing was to be done (old analog system) the dings of the triangle would be clearly audible by the engineers. (For those of you that have not watched tape editing, the editor will slowly hand reel the tape while listening for an obvious note to stand out and cut on.)

    If you listen carefully to the recording, you will hear several little dings of the triangle.....almost randomly. He added many more than 4 dings to the part so that was needed for the splice points, just to make it be more musical. But, three of those dings are splice points.

    Although Mendez and his sons were a bit dissappointed that he decided to save his lip (don't forget, he recorded the rest of the album that day as well!) by not going all the way through in a straight shot, they were very pleased that only ONE TAKE WAS NEEDED for the MOTO!

    Now, that's impressive!!

    To my knowledge, Mendez never performed the MOTO in a concert. Does anyone out there know of a time he did?

    _________________________

    The notes on Nakariakov's CD indicate that he also recorded this piece in sections, but do not indicate how many. Like Hickman, I am tremendously impressed by Mendez' breath control and accuracy. I have tried to compute how many successive notes he hit without any flubs or cracked notes--it must be several thousand.

    Tim"
     
  10. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    If Hickman posted it, then it should be findable. If it isn't findable, then................
     

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