Testing A Possible New Way To Tune A Trumpet

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Dr.Mark, Jul 3, 2013.

  1. Dr.Mark

    Dr.Mark Mezzo Forte User

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    I'd have to agree with tobylou8 in that it is more you (us) than it is the horn.
    The whole concept of "perception" (the intergration of stimuli hitting our receptors and how we interpret) is in large part a personal thing. It can be shaped by predisposition, current state of mind (is the person happy or angry at the time when they experience the act) or what's going on around the person at that given time. Yes, machines can tell us definitively what is and isn't, but it is up to us with our "human" characteristics to determine how we "feel" about a sound, smell, taste, or sight.
    Take the Martin Committee for example. Most people on this site know that Miles Davis in the 1950's early 60's(who from my perception had a beautiful dark introspective sound) made the Martin Committee famous. Now, let's leave the 1950-60's and go forward about 50 years. Today, thousands of people have either purchased or are looking for this horn knowing how it can sound and the sound most are looking for is a Miles Davis sound. However, surprise, surprise, Maynard Ferguson played the Martin Committee too! Miles actually gave Maynard one of his Committees but later took it back (but that's another story for another time). The point being, just think if Maynard made the Martin famous instead of Miles. Then all the high note wannabe's would be clammering to get their hands on a vintage Committee to sound like, you guessed it, Maynard Ferguson. I guess many people buy a particular horn to sound like someone they admire. Maybe how we preceive is a blessing and a curse. Interestingly, I've never cursed about having too much imagination but I do occasionally curse because of a lack it.
    Dr.Mark
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2013
  2. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    but isn't it typical of a man over 40 to have lost some hearing? such that the audible range is more like 20 Hz to 8K Hz? although I have found in some literature that -"Inaudible infrasonic sound waves can be felt by humans through physical body vibration in the range of 4 to 16 Hz". --------------------- and of course, it is apparent that women retain their "hearing" long than men. ----------------------------these are just interesting concepts when we(anyone) is testing this method. since depending on the age of the "tester", they (we) may have already lost some Auditory sensitivity, such that the "sound" through the lead pipe is not quite as perceivable as that which goes through the horn (and is a bit louder) ----- just saying, perhaps this is reflected in the results that Dr. Mark is getting. ---------------perhaps it could also be reflected in the people WHO DISAGREE, who may be older and suffered some hearing loss. Tis my vantage point that most people do not realize any hearing loss, unless they get tested on a regular basis like me (I get an audiogram yearly) ----- just some thought about hearing!!!
    PS. no wonder women yell at us men ---- "they can apparently hear more than we do anyhow" --- very interesting concept!!!!
     
  3. Dr.Mark

    Dr.Mark Mezzo Forte User

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    Wow KT,
    You bring out a good point!
    Along with how we preceive is the idea of how well does the receptors work at different ages. I think over the years, my noisy kids have rounded my receptors to a nub at best.
    Dr.Mark
     
  4. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    yes, there are a lot of thresholds for "noise levels" that eventually take their toll on our hearing abilities beyond just the age factor. Noises over 80 Decibals can permanently cause hearing damage. Something most of us never think about until it is too late. (ie. mowing the lawn, chainsaws, loud tractors, shooting guns -- most of which are well over the 80 decibals , 80 decibels being the baseline that is the threshold SAFE level) -- even in domestic settings (vacuum cleaners, blenders, and such) for prolonged periods of times can cause hearing loss) ------ I generally use the earmuffs when I am doing Loud activities to limit damage ---- but I would say a majority of us men (older than 40 ish) have probably undertaken noise laden activities in our youth that have already resulted in hearing loss). Nonetheless, I think it is perhaps a factor in this tuning method, and how we perceive the SOUND of any instrument in general.
     
  5. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

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    Sorry to burst your sound bubble KT, but THIS old man posting this response just made it through the test of the entire sound range... including the range into which the Martin Committee out performs the other horns in the test conducted by tj 10-15,000 Hz range:

    The Human Hearing Range - YouTube

    To all TMers out there... give this test a try. See if you are "Committee" worthy!
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2013
  6. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

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    Come on guys and gals... you cannot say Dr. Mark (and I) are not on to something... Martin Committee out performs other trumpets into the 10-20,000 Hz range.... Perhaps the DARK SIDE of those trumpets that sound dark to those passing the above "Committee Worthy" test... AND those trumpets that are in "tuning equilibrium" right to left side of the horn with slide length tuned equal to the tuning against a perfectly tuned piano.

    Thanks for your test tj... I think you may be redirecting where this discussion is going. But it will come full circle.
     
  7. Dr.Mark

    Dr.Mark Mezzo Forte User

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    I have to agree, For me, my 1953 Martin Committee is an important part of my tool kit. It can idle sensitively with songs like Somewhere Over the Rainbow or My Funny Valentine or it can smoke the tires with songs like McArthur Park or Give It One. The valves are great, it sounds great, and not a dent or blemish in sight. This thing is like a vintage Chevy that you'd see at an auto show. Here's the problem I have with it.
    I wish my engine and chassis would have held up as well as my Committee. The most I can do is drive it around and know that in my hands rests a horn that in no way holds me back. Just a damned great tool.
    Dr.Mark
     
  8. kingtrumpet

    kingtrumpet Utimate User

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    your a crazy old man -- there is no sound at 8 KHz or above!!! --- nice joke to play on us!!! ROFL ROFL ROFL
     
  9. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    20 to 14575 Hz.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2013
  10. tobylou8

    tobylou8 Utimate User

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