Throwing this out there for the designers out there

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by Cornyandy, Aug 29, 2013.

  1. Brekelefuw

    Brekelefuw Fortissimo User

    Mar 21, 2006
    Hold the horn how it is comfortable.
    If I played with my horn parallel to the ground, I would have a sore neck and back by the end of set 1.
  2. Sethoflagos

    Sethoflagos Utimate User

    Aug 7, 2013
    Lagos, Nigeria
    ...speaking of sacrilege.

    How about those new plastic trumpet (plumpets?). Are they significantly lighter?

    Does asking a child to do a few press-ups every morning infringe their human rights?
  3. eviln3d

    eviln3d Pianissimo User

    Jun 5, 2013
    Maybe a solution would be a plastic trumpet. I've seen videos of them and they seemed to sound reasonably well, don't know if they are harder to get a sound on than brass ones, but they are probably lighter.
  4. Dean_0

    Dean_0 Piano User

    Jan 21, 2013
    I'm not clear here on your problem? are you trying to deal with a student who has a physical limitation ,or is it just lazy-ness?

    If it's just untrained ,lazy ,then i would try to convince the student that they will play much better with a straight posture .

    As for the lazy ,it would depend on how badly they want to learn the proper technique , but anyway ,just like we did back then kids have a way of finding the strength ,attitude that they need, if we only show them what is expected of them,do it right or don't do it?

    Most likely there is someone who can tweak a horn to your specs but i would think the price might be a least for a starting player?

  5. rankamateur

    rankamateur Mezzo Forte User

    May 1, 2013
    Merry Ol' England
    Hi Andy

    There is a lot of this slouchy playing about, to be sure, but I don't think brass bands are conducive to proper posture either. So many players seem to have their stands ridiculously low, so of course they are going to blow downwards. It's a vicious circle really. They develop the habit, and a poor embouchure so they need to have their stands low to support that and it just reinforces the habit. Possibly?

    Why not have a word with our mutual friend Bryan Robson? He could surely design the kind of thing you are looking for, if it's technically viable. But then you've got to get them made, market them and convince people to buy them. That could be the most difficult part. And they are going to be costly!

    You know, those plastic trumpets might be the answer if it's really the weight of the instrument that is the issue, but in most cases I doubt that it is. Sounds like an excuse to me. What are you going to do when they complain that their fingers are tired from pressing the valves?
  6. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

    Jan 9, 2010
    East Yorkshire
    It's a more general issue I see with children over here Dean_0

    If it is just simple laziness so be it it (isn't too much af a problem with my students they need reminding sometimes but the rules are there (I'm not some martinet that insists on a level horn but they keep it up to a reasonable level))

    It is actually what I see in school where these bad habits are formed in large group lessons where the teacher doesn't have time to check each child. Perhaps I should just accept that it is the teaching that is at fault rather than the instrument.

    I have discussed this issue with Brian his answer if the same as mine, start them on the cornet for a couple of years, they are easier to get a good tone out of, more compact and easier to hold. The problem is certainly in this countrry the education authorities (unless there are a lot af Brass Banders around) insist on "proffesional" instruments so they tend only to want to provide trumpets, trombones and french horns. That actually will lead to another beef. One child I know was given a french horn to learn on "because that is all that was left" rather than that she wanted to play it the poor kid could barely hold it. not just an argument about weight or anything like that. She was literally to small to reach the into the bell to damp the instrument properly. Not suprisingly she gave it up after a few weeks.

    I know where you are coming from with Brass Bands as well there are a lot of odd mouthpiece placements, flat fingers into the ground players out there in that world too.
  7. nieuwguyski

    nieuwguyski Forte User

    Aug 9, 2004
    Santa Cruz County, CA
    Thein makes, or at least used to make, exactly what you're describing:

    The Thein "compact trumpet" is/was (their website doesn't appear to have been updated recently) designed specifically for children. I suspect it's far more expensive than what you have in mind, but it does show that designers and builders do sometimes address your concerns.

    Back in the 1930's, any number of U.S. makers built cornets in this layout:


    (This image has previously been posted on TM in this thread: .)

    There's an extra, horizontal loop of tubing in the bell tail, shortening the horn and creating a second tuning slide, so that one slide can be used for tuning to A. These old cornets are not too hard to find on ebay, and are usually pretty cheap. You should be able to use one as a template.
  8. ulli926

    ulli926 New Friend

    Dec 21, 2010
    compact trumpet, esp. designed for children:
    Thein Brass
    Eclipse had one as well, called the Equinox, but is no longer listed in their product line up.
    regards ulli

    ps: sorry, can not copy the picture. Please go to Trompete on the Thein Brass homepage. Then look for Kompakttrompete.
  9. Cornyandy

    Cornyandy Fortissimo User

    Jan 9, 2010
    East Yorkshire
    Thanks for that one that is exactly the sort of thing I was wondering about. Cheers ulli
  10. rankamateur

    rankamateur Mezzo Forte User

    May 1, 2013
    Merry Ol' England
    There are other possibilities such as the Bontempi TR4231 or the Reig Deluxe, and they are well within anyone's budget for a child's horn.

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