Tine Helseth's vibrato

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by kehaulani, May 9, 2014.

  1. Solar Bell

    Solar Bell Moderator Staff Member

    May 11, 2005
    Metro Detroit
    Doctors Gary and Mike.........

    Can ANYONE control their diaphragm?
  2. trumpetsplus

    trumpetsplus Fortissimo User

    Jun 11, 2006
    South Salem, NY
    Seems to me it is a good question to ask her at the ITG in 2 weeks.
  3. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

    Jun 18, 2006
    The diaphragm is only there to INHALE. I know as mine was severely damaged and I still played with it for 6 months before getting it operated. You can't achieve any controlled vibrato with it. Perhaps the abs could be used for vibrato - but why? Vibrato should be a carefully dosed fine motor activity and the face muscles and tongue are ideal for this type of work. I can assure you, that the vibrato with all of the finest players is not achieved below the neck.

    In any case, who cares. To play like her needs much, much more than "vibrato".
  4. feedback@stomvi-usa

    [email protected] Piano User

    Jan 24, 2012
    Newhall California
    Ask her on Facebook, you might get a response.
  5. Dean_0

    Dean_0 Piano User

    Jan 21, 2013

    Funny that i was reading about this very thing the other day,although i haven't been concerned about it as of yet ?

    From 101 trumpet tips
    Stuff the Pro's know and use ;
    By Scott Barnard

    HAND VIBRATO -This method requires you move the trumpet on and off the embouchure with the right hand. However ,it could lead to some bad habits with m/p pressure and be very tiring,so is best avoided.

    DIAPHRAGM/BREATH VIBRATO -Achieved by varying the pressure of air,much as a flautist would do,But on a brass instrument,this is harder to control for this purpose and so is rarely used.

    LIP/JAW VIBRATO - This method is more widely used and is very controllable.The pitch variation is made by changing the pitch of the buzz up and down small amount : this is helped by moving the jaw up and down very slightly at the same time.

    A Great book ,,and well worth the price ,to help with polishing things up .:play:

    Sry for the long reply but this explains it best for me ,and if i was to guess i think Tine uses this method ,even though i have been so impressed with her playing i hardly noticed :D:-o

  6. kehaulani

    kehaulani Fortissimo User

    May 14, 2011
    Hawaian homey
    Please note that I put the word diaphragm in "quotes" because that's what it's usually called. Probably "abdominal" would be a more accurate word.
    Regarding it's use, that's what flute players do. I know that some sax and clarinet players use it as well. Wasn't sure about trumpet players.

    Think I'll give that a try. Thanks.
  7. gmonady

    gmonady Utimate User

    Jan 28, 2011
    Dayton, Ohio
    Rowuk is correct. But you see most of our respiration is managed by and involuntary response in our central nervous system. This is driven by arterial PO2 and PCO2 levels as well as lung volume feedback to respiratory centers. This allows us to breath when we sleep or drink large quantities of beer and do not have the capacity to know if we need to breath... or not... but to only make the moves on the redhead sitting at the end of the bar.

    However, we do have the ability to volunarily override the breathing center were we can use higher integrated sections of the brain to say to our respiratory center "Breath damn it!" AND the override is done and the center now under volunteer command send a signal down the same efferent pathway to the diaphragm... and as rowuk so correctly stated, we inhale.

    Many times we trumpet players do this to expand our lung volume to super human levels to play as good as me, a super human, and other times just to get enough air in to inhale the perfume that the redhead is wearing. At this point, we begin to pant heavily with anticipation of yet for things to come, which then goes involuntary as the blood rushes to our, Ahem, head...
  8. sj3209

    sj3209 Piano User

    Nov 22, 2006
    Amador County, Calif.
    The lady sitting next to me at the bar with the wedding ring always leaves me breathless.
  9. kehaulani

    kehaulani Fortissimo User

    May 14, 2011
    Hawaian homey
    gmonady - I thought the process of deep breathing (yogic, instrumentalist, etc.) was caused not by the diaphragm doing its thing, but that the abdominal muscles pulled (involuntarily) the diaphragm down which, in turn, opened up the lungs to created a vacuum in the lungs which sucked the air in. No?

    BTW, regarding my posting a message on her facebook, she's currently on a tour of the US, so she might not answer soon (if ever) but if/when she does, I'll follow up and post what she said.
  10. BigDub

    BigDub Fortissimo User

    Dec 19, 2009
    Hillsborough, NJ
    You are so silly, Doc.
    Sorry, I couldn't help myself.
    My diaphragm was distended and constricting my brain from proper brain activity.

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