Tried a valved trombone

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by jladams, Mar 31, 2011.

  1. ZeuSter

    ZeuSter Pianissimo User

    107
    4
    May 22, 2004
    I have doubled on trombone (slide and valve) for years , that puffy chops feeling goes away after you practice on both for a couple aof weeks.
    Practicing long tones on both instruments helps a lot , once you develop a trombone embouchure then switching back and forth is not a problem.
     
  2. kctrumpeteer

    kctrumpeteer Piano User

    303
    23
    Dec 23, 2009
    I just recently picked up a baritone for fun to play from time to time and picked up a new mouthpiece (I think a 6 1/2 ) what ever that equates to ... I think a standard beginner type trombone MP.

    I have started trying to play (yet) as I dropped the baritone by the shop to get it 'play ready' but by buzzing on the MP it seems like day / night difference from buzzing with a trumpet mouthpiece.

    Any recommendations for how to make the transition from a trumpet to the baritone? I was always given the impression it was an easy transition between the two, but right away they feel very different.
     
  3. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

    8,040
    2,035
    Aug 16, 2009
    Jackson NC
    I'm quite sure your 6 1/2 mpc actually is a 6 1/2 AL and what the "AL" stands for I don't know, however it is one the two common mpcs I've played on trombone, baritone, and euphonium and the one I much prefer over the other a 12 C.

    If you play the baritone in the treble clef which partially you can once you attain the ability, the fingering is the same as Bb trumpet, however when you play in the bass clef, the fingering is different. If you Google "baritone fingering" you'll be referred to a fingering chart as also applies to the euphonium. The question is: Can you read the bass clef? Concert notes (vis a C instrument) place G in the fourth space, and an A as the top line. That said G is again the bottom line (an octave lower) and A is the bottom space.

    Admittedly, in the beginning the switcheroo is not easy and may play havoc on the tone of both instruments, but given time and equal practice it will become easier and eventually second nature.
     
  4. nieuwguyski

    nieuwguyski Forte User

    1,491
    587
    Aug 9, 2004
    Santa Cruz County, CA
    "A" stands for the deepest Bach cup, "L" denotes a larger-than-standard throat and a big backbore. The 6.5AL was originally designed as a euphonium mouthpiece (and the OP's baritone is almost certainly functionally closer to a euphonium than a real baritone horn).

    It's a fairly large mouthpiece. I double on trombone a fair amount, and don't use a mouthpiece that large. I didn't use a mouthpiece that large when trombone was my main instrument. But lots of players use 'em.
     
  5. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

    8,040
    2,035
    Aug 16, 2009
    Jackson NC
    Thanks for the "lesson", although it makes little difference in actuality for me as (1) I like it, and (2) I primarlily have played the euphonium (and hope to be back at it again by the end of this year) , and (3) I've favored it even on the trombone as opposed to the 12C as came with the 'bone although I've often used the 12C on both 'bone and euph" in a switch up from tuba or "Suzy". The last time I played a baritone was either in eighth grade or as a freshman in HS and that was only once or twice, maybe three times at the most. Most of the band were switchers then ... we had to be ... whereas many juniors and seniors were enlisting in the military (the end of WWII & beginning of the Korean Conflict). I do know the baritone is like a trumpet whereas the euphonium is more like a cornet, the later being conical throughout.
     
  6. kctrumpeteer

    kctrumpeteer Piano User

    303
    23
    Dec 23, 2009
    I had done quite a bit of research on the baritone vs euphonium and via one of the more music oriented shops (e.g. a shop where they have music majors and people that study and do music vs looking up a sku on a computer) they told me that the Euphonium would be more of the serious musicians choice to get and also potentially recommending to get a compensating euphonium and conical / cylindrical is similar in a baritone vs a euphonium like a trumpet vs a cornet although I have heard of more of a difference in sound between the bass instruments versus trumpet/cornet.

    Personally I don't plan on getting too serious with a baritone, just want to expand on my musical range and I paid < $200 (if you count a brand new mouthpiece and shop prep to get out some dings and clean it up) VERY good price... All my money goes to trumpets/flugels.

    So far as reading music I will probably stick to treble clef, but feel (me personally) that I really need to pick up the base clef because it will help me with piano, etc. in knowing how to better read treble/base clef. And I don't plan on learning too much with piano but have one to aid in my studio aka spare bedroom.

    I suppose the other thought on picking up the baritone is that it would be much easier for a trumpet player to play versus a tuba or something else that I am not interested in and I might even join some friends next year for Tuba Christmas as I hear you can play with a baritone/euphonium.
     
  7. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

    8,040
    2,035
    Aug 16, 2009
    Jackson NC
    My Conn Artist 3 valve non-compensating euphonium cost me $40 and had no case or mpc. I bought a back pack Protec gig case for it and had some repair work done also as brought my total to near $300. Really, if you don't expect to play in a symphony you'll not have much need for a tuba, and if you don't expect to play in a marching band, the Sousaphone isn't much needed either. I already had my 12C and 6 1/2 AL for my "bone.

    Yep, IMO there is more tone spread between the baritone and euphonium / "bone than a cornet and trumpet.

    Reading the bass clef I don't feel is that difficult, especially if you are at all oriiented to a piano. On ledger line below the treble staff is a concert C aka middle C. The rest of the bass clef then descends in reverse order the seven notes in music alternating space and line on the white keys. A black key to the right sharpens the white key before it, and a black key to the left flattens it. Too, most baritones in US are Bb instruments!

    Certainly you can play Tuba Christmas on your baritone or any other song (once you become proficent with it). I've played many a melody on my euphonium, and speaking of Christmas I played Silent Night solo on it. My wife's comment is that the euphonium "voice" is closer to my vocal voice than any of my other instruments.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2011
  8. nieuwguyski

    nieuwguyski Forte User

    1,491
    587
    Aug 9, 2004
    Santa Cruz County, CA
    The cited differences between euphonium and baritone would be valid, if the U.S. had any tradition of making true baritone horns. I don't know what you have, but unless it's a Besson, Yamaha, or other non-U.S. make made specifically for the brass band market, it probably isn't a real baritone.

    Baritone or Euphonium?
     
  9. Ed Lee

    Ed Lee Utimate User

    8,040
    2,035
    Aug 16, 2009
    Jackson NC
    The easiest way that I know to determine which is which: is it a baritone or euphonium ... is to pull the tuning slide and attempt to insert it singly in reverse. If it fits, you've a baritone, if not you've a euphonium. My Conn Artist euphonium has a angled detachable bell that can be tightened in any direction. Some have said this was for recording enhancement and may have been in earlier times but I don't see such now with such as clip on mikes.
     
  10. nieuwguyski

    nieuwguyski Forte User

    1,491
    587
    Aug 9, 2004
    Santa Cruz County, CA
    I can't disagree with this, as my Olds Studio euphonium has a conical tuning slide too. But it was originally marketed, by Olds, as a "baritone."

    1957 Olds Catalog
     

Share This Page