ultra-sonic clean

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by alant, Sep 11, 2011.

  1. alant

    alant Pianissimo User

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    Aug 18, 2009
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    i have a 30 year old bach strad cornet that has never had an ultra-sonic clean. Would the cornet benefit from a clean? would it sound any different?
     
  2. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    I know many players that keep their horns so clean that chemical or ultrasonic cleaning offers them essentially nothing. If you are not one of those people, a cleaning could be of benefit. Whether it sounds different, depends on how good you are. Weak chops would not show much if any difference.

    The main advantage to getting the goo out is that the horn lasts and holds its value longer.

    I feel much better when playing horns that do not have things crawling in the direction of the mouthpiece!
     
  3. bumblebee

    bumblebee Fortissimo User

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    I know you meant crawling in the direction of the mouthpiece from inside the horn, but you could also consider things crawling in the direction of the mouthpiece from outside the hown -- might make a good (bad?) mutant-zombie-movie scene... that's what I initially visualised anyway.

    --bumblebee
     
  4. mrsemman

    mrsemman Piano User

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    alant,

    I am fortunate enough to own my own ultrasonic cleaner, and have cleaned several horns that were at least 30 years old and some older. If the horn has not been cleaned in a long time, or if there is a lot of "crud" in the pipes (just pull the main tuning slide off and have a look through the lead pipe), then an ultrasonic cleaning could work wonders. It's funny to watch, as a dark cloud spews from the open areas. Almost like an evil shadow leaving the horn; and yes, a cleaner horn will sound much better without the "crud" in it.
     
  5. coolerdave

    coolerdave Utimate User

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    The revelation hits when you are talking about 30 year old horns.... because I am playing horns from the early 20's .... these babies are old. Heck even a horn made in 1962 is 50 years old ..... is anybody else feeling what I am feeling here
     
  6. mrsemman

    mrsemman Piano User

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  7. flugelgirl

    flugelgirl Forte User

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    If your horn has any red rot an ultra sonic clean cAn actually do more harm than good. Better in that case to opt for a regular chem clean.
     
  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    I have questions about ultrasonic clean that have not been answered adequately. VW destroyed fuel injection nozzles with ultrasonic cleaning a while back. The process seemed to change the hardness of the metal.

    I would think that a trumpet is MUCH more sensitive. Its special tone is the result of tension in the metal in special places, forged or milled braces with similar issues. I am not sure how aggressive the ultrasound baths are - and am pretty sure that the "average" tech rejoice more in the dirt removed rather in the sound changed (if they notice at all).

    I know that Monette uses chem cleaning. Kind of tells me all that I need to know.
     
  9. bumblebee

    bumblebee Fortissimo User

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    Hi Rowuk, on Dave Monette's facebook page he has mentioned ultrasonic cleaning a few times, including cleaning Wynton's horn that way:
    Videos Posted by David Monette Trumpets: WYNTON'S RAJA IN SHOP... PDX CONCERT TONIGHT! [HQ] | Facebook

    Maybe there are different classes of cleaner for different purposes?

    --bumblebee
     
  10. mrsemman

    mrsemman Piano User

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    I use an Ultra Power ultrasonic cleaner (39 gallon model) with the company recommended 1/2 gallon of phosphoric acid and a couple tablespoons of Dawn solution, which is diluted in 39 gallons of water. I set the cycle to 80 and bath the instrument for about 3 minutes; then rinse in fresh water for several minutes and then put it together with oiled valve pistons and lanolin on the slides.

    I was warned, during my training, to be careful in cleaning older horns, as the solder at joints could already be weakened and this might cause further damage in those areas. However, newer horns should not be affected during the minimum time they spend in a diluted acid solution.
     

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