valve help........again!

Discussion in 'Trumpet Discussion' started by crowmadic, Feb 25, 2009.

  1. crowmadic

    crowmadic Mezzo Piano User

    688
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    Oct 3, 2006
    I really like playing my 1958 Olds Ambassador but i'm not happy with the valve action. I have other horns like a 1953 Noble and a 1963 Conn Victor 22B that have better action. I'll describe the difference by using compression. The olds feels like it has more air to compress in the casing than the other two horns. It just doesn't have that "buttery" feel that I like. Aside from the springs and oil would it make sense to change the stems or finger buttons to lighter material? It's such a nice horn to play except for the vale action...........any constructive suggestions? I'd like to remedy it myself if possible.

    crow
     
  2. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Crow,
    the action is not really affected by the mass at the relatively low speeds that we can push the valves at. Claiming better accelleration through less mass sounds good, but just does not hold when the real weight to power - friction is all added up.

    The buttery feel is how the valves have, through age worn into the casing and the oil that you are using. If the valves are really worn and you are using a very thin oil, the lubricating film breaks kind of defeating the real purpose. A slightly higher viscosity oil can often work wonders. I use LaTromba T2, but Hetmans also has a very fine synthetic for worn valves too.

    Depending on the amount of wear, getting them relapped into the casing can give them new life. If too much is worn, a replating/relapping job will bring them up to snuff.
     
  3. gzent

    gzent Fortissimo User

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    Rochester, MN
    I've done many a polishing of Olds valves and it does help a lot.

    If however you get to the point where the plating wears through to the brass then replating will be necessary to keep them from sticking.
     
  4. crowmadic

    crowmadic Mezzo Piano User

    688
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    Oct 3, 2006
    They are not sticking. Upon further examination i've determined that the Noble' springs have less tension than the Olds springs. I don't think the two music stores in my town have the kind of spring selection necessary to solve this. Any suggestions on how I can acquire springs to try before purchase?

    crow
     
  5. crowmadic

    crowmadic Mezzo Piano User

    688
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    Oct 3, 2006
    rowuk,
    i'm also going to try the LaTromba T2 and Hetman's synthetic for worn valves.

    crow
     
  6. Rushtucky

    Rushtucky Pianissimo User

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    Sep 15, 2008
    Indianapolis, Indiana
    Go to your music store that has a good tech department and they might let you try a set of springs before purchasing. Most are pretty good about it.
     
  7. Markie

    Markie Forte User

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    Jan 4, 2009
    Clarksburg, WV
    Hi crowmatic,
    Now if what I'm going to suggest is "old hat" to you, just disregard it as I mean no disrespect.
    a) is your pinky up or in the pinky ring?
    b)are you playing with the fingertips?
    Sometimes a problem with valve action is the result of pushing the valves in an off center way. I've found that students(including myself) will put a lot of stress in their hands (and fingers) when the playing gets challenging. See if you are experiencing the same thing when the the playing gets challenging.
     
  8. rowuk

    rowuk Moderator Staff Member

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    Crow,
    you can stretch the springs for more tension or compress them (actually bend them with a set of pliers) for less. Quite a bit of variety is available. The less tension the better the lube job has to be!
     
  9. Rushtucky

    Rushtucky Pianissimo User

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    Sep 15, 2008
    Indianapolis, Indiana
    Have you possibly considered lapping your valves?
     
  10. Vulgano Brother

    Vulgano Brother Moderator Staff Member

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    More fun with old springs-try tempering them after stretching (I've done this at a rehearsal before using a cigarette lighter to heat and an unwitting bassoonist's little water supply to quench them.) It seemed to help a bit, and sure killed time in the rehearsal.
     

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